Pic of No4T in desert???

[trooper554877]

Due to some discussion on the use of snipers in the desert, I came across this pic from a lesson plan given to aussie snipers on course.
I cannot verify the source of the pic nor a description, i was wondering if anyone else had some knowledge of the pic?
interesting ammo belt.

Also is Afghanistan described as desert?
The employment of snipers and designated marksman there has been proven to be irreplaceable in terms of efficiency
Anyway just thought I would open the debate.

cheers
Ned

Attachment 34642.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Peter Laidler]

Paratrooper in Aden/Radfan. Note the little clasp knife hanging from the string. I can't discuss the use of our snipers in theatre Trooper, but they're not deployed as we think of snipers as such. Tooooooooo dodgy!

[trooper554877]

I know EXACTLY what you mean peter,
I was not trying to reveal what they are doing today just making the point in reference to the previous postings of snipers in the desert in WW2 more than anything.
Not trying to say that this pic was one but to make the point of that they ARE used in desert conditions.
Anyway what date would this pic be?
60's?
I thought it relevant as it is one of only a few that are post WW2.

cheers
Ned

[Peter Laidler]

I think it was 1966/7 and the Radfan mountains. There was scope to really act as snipers there, to ambush those attacking the hill forts. Incidentally, Paratroopers in Aden (and Gurkhas in Borneo) were the very last to use Vickers MMG's in action in 1968

[gwahlert]

Yep. Uniform appears typical of Brit Army in Aden, circa 1960s. There's no question that we (Aussies) have used sniper rifles successfully in the desert (meaning not just sand, but terrain devoid of vegitation). Afghanistan is an excellent contemporary example. Just see recent edition of Army Newspaper http://digital.realviewtechnologies....enews_army.xml for article on recent award of Medal of Gallantry to a 5th Bn sniper. CO's and Coy Comds that have served in Afghanistan have all confirmed how valued sniping is to integrated bn ops. It has saved lives. 9th Aust Div used the P14 with scope at Tobruk very successfully in taking out German crew-served weapons and selected soldiers (eg. NCOs and offrs). German interviews after war verified how accurate the Aust shooting was. There were unique problems with sniping in the desert, as there were in the jungle, but these obstacles were eventually overcome and effective tactics, techniques and procedures developed. However, the 2nd AIF never seemed to reach the pinnacle of sniper efficiency as they had by 1918 in the the First War. Korea even less so. And in Vietnam we did next to no sniper ops (just two low-level sniper intecepts by D Coy 8 RAR using US XM-21 rifles). Aust Army has only recently discovered the true value of the sniper in war.

[trooper554877]

Thanks Colonel,
that should put to bed this debate.
have you come across robbie robertson in your research?
sniper in korea.
I had a copy of his sydney herald? interview of years ago of his exploits.
till the laptop decided that it was time to be taken out by a drone strike!!!



cheers
Ned

[ActionYobbo]

That pic looks staged, looks like some pog got a rifle and made a war pic
In my opinion the hold is wrong for several reasons (like advertising) and the knife is a flasher and the belt looks like a safari piece.
The hat is 58 or later

[gwahlert]

Thanx Ned. Yes, aware of Robbie. I have the extracts from a few interviews he did, including with Andrew Denton. I also managed to interview Kevin Tupper, who was a sniper with 2 RAR in Korea. He sent me a copy of a manuscript his sniper partner, Frenchy Ray, wrote on sniping in Korea. Overall, it appears that sniping wasn't very professional in Korea. Kev said that while he was given a good rifle (SMLE Mk.III* HT), the first time he got to fire it was actually in Korea. There was also no training. He and Frenchy were natural shots, but had to learn sniping through trial and error. Kev thought they were both lucky to survive - it was only that the Chinese they faced knew even less about sniping than they did. They also had one of the first Starlight IR scopes used by an Army. Only problem was they had to carry a car-sized battery around to power the bolody thing.
Thanx for your interest, Ned. It is a facinating subject.
Glenn

[trooper554877]

Thanx Ned. Yes, aware of Robbie. I have the extracts from a few interviews he did, including with Andrew Denton. I also managed to interview Kevin Tupper, who was a sniper with 2 RAR in Korea. He sent me a copy of a manuscript his sniper partner, Frenchy Ray, wrote on sniping in Korea. Overall, it appears that sniping wasn't very professional in Korea. Kev said that while he was given a good rifle (SMLE Mk.III* HT), the first time he got to fire it was actually in Korea. There was also no training. He and Frenchy were natural shots, but had to learn sniping through trial and error. Kev thought they were both lucky to survive - it was only that the Chinese they faced knew even less about sniping than they did. They also had one of the first Starlight IR scopes used by an Army. Only problem was they had to carry a car-sized battery around to power the bolody thing.
Thanx for your interest, Ned. It is a facinating subject.
Glenn

It really is an interesting subject for sure.
please keep me on the list for a book when it's availiable.

if you PM me I can give you the name of someone else that really needs to be included.
cheers
Ned

[muffett.2008]

Attachment 34661This one then?