1944 BSA No. 4 Mk 1 (T) Less Telescope

[jmoore]

...therefore didn't get the scope number stamped on the wrist or the T stamp on the action side...

If there's no "T" under the paint, then blurrededge DOES seem to have the logical explanation. Wouldn't be hugely surprising in retrospect, given the large number of H&H conversions in '44. What would be odd then would be the finish and staking...Interesting!

[boltaction]

The rifle I was just offered is as I said identically marked and only a few serial numbers off. I haven't had it in hand yet, only photos. However, there is one difference--its rearsight is a Mk III, one of those tinny ones without the fine adjustment knob. The ones I am seeing in this post and also in the MKL all have the more proper fine adjust rearsight with the battle aperture lopped off. Is it possible that those were added later, or has the one I'm looking at just been switched at some point? It seems odd to set a rifle up as a potential T and then leave the lower quality rearsight on............

Attachment 42000Attachment 42001Attachment 42002Attachment 42003Attachment 42004Attachment 42005Attachment 42006Attachment 42007

Ed

[jmoore]

Is it possible that those were added later, or has the one I'm looking at just been switched at some point?

Switched.

Odd to note that both rifles have the late rear swivel assembly, but no middle swivel. Very curious.

[blurrededge]

My Less T appears never to have had the centre swivel fitted either, as it was fitted from late 44 at extra cost (Laidler), it kinda makes sense it's not on these Less T's I recon. I'm thinking that when the post war instruction came round to stake all the 4T pad screws they just included these Less T's in with it, and they didn't stamp the T on the action because as before, no scope fitted.

[Maple_Leaf_Eh]

Having been staked and given it's vintage, you'd think it would have had a telescope at some point. At least before the Suncorite was applied. (Probably when the staking was done.) Any signs of a "ghost" number on top of the wrist?

Might be hard to see but this looks like a good candidate to inquire: Any marking on the top of the forestock under the front pad?

I.e.:

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...4d25afb2-1.jpg
In this location but on top of the wood.

There is an X stamp there. Anyone have an explanation?

[jmoore]

Have two or three suspicions. But the sample size is small. None that I know of on rifles without staked front pads so far. But don't read too much into it. Just gathering info at this point.

[DanL96a1]

I also have a Lee Enfield No.4 Mk.1 (T) made in 1945 M47C Less Telescope rifle with chest, and a miss matched Mk.3 scope, I noticed that like the one shown in the picture https://www.milsurps.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=41938&d=1365628034 mine has an “I” at the end of the transit chest too, dose any one know what this means? Or can translate this into English?
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Regards
DanL96A1

[Maple_Leaf_Eh]

That big Roman numeral I could mean anything. Most quartermasters have their own numbering and control measures, and these vary between units and change. For example, I knew one QM that assigned rack space for each firearm. That lasted until the unit got new stock without losing the old ones, and there was no more spare room. If a box or folded tent is stacked on a rack, the idea is to make it easy to count at a glance.

I doubt the letter I is alphabetical or numbering. Instead, I would suspect it is a condition code. NS for nonserviceable, US for unserviceable, BLR for beyond line repair, I for inspected, S for serviceable, C for complete, etc.

[Peter Laidler]

No4T's without telescopes never even got out of the Ordnance Depots in the Army system due to the fact that a sniper rifle without a telescope is like a Taxi without a taxi sign...... It's just another Ford car - or in this case, another rifle. That's the reason why they'll rarely, if ever be modified. No swivel because who's going to use it in the single-point position? Not staked either as with no telescope, what sort of cenrifuge effect going to rock the pads to create the loose pad and screws.

If I had my grumpy Quartermasters hat on (nope, never was one but know how the tight fisted a------s think, believe me.....) I'd say that a sniper rifle in a chest without a telescope is just an expensive way of storing fresh air!

[Surpmil]

My first rifle was identical in every respect. N32239 1944 rifle, same staking, chest, markings, finish everything but the band.