Here's a question..........

[TactAdv]

in what specific dimensions is the bolt shorter?? Do you mean depth of bolt face, or the whole bolt BODY is shorter. Not doing anything more than looking to make it successfully go 'bang' in .308.

Yeah, ummmm, I -KNOW- what a "L34" is......just brain farted when typing it. ;-)

-TomH

Information

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[Brit plumber]

The overall length is longer than the .303, not much but enough that it won't fit and battery in a .303. Peter may be able to explain why, it may even link in with his question.

---------- Post added at 09:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:20 AM ----------

Have you thought about the South African conversion? Probably an easier conversion for 7.62.

[Peter Laidler]

South African 7.62mm conversion........... Cheaper, but rubbish! We know now, following my total failure trying, that a home L4 type conversion CAN be successful

[TactAdv]

I guess I need to post up some pictures of the .308/7,62mm BBL I have here. It's not an "L4" BBL to be sure, but it is an arsenal/professionally-produced item. It's carrying a clone of the metric style "FN-FAL" flash hider-compensator from the "factory" so it looks weird. Any ideas/information as to origins is highly desired by me. SA origins...?? Then it could be an R1 clone muzzle device??

In some brief measurements though, it APPEARS to be made to fit with the std .303 bolt I am messing with.......anyway.......I'm me putting up some pictures FIRST before you go too deep into tearing me a new.......you know what.... ;-)

These images attached here are not mine originally, they are from a GB auction that I got it on. Looks NOS condition. I will have to get better images that show clearly the actual markings later tonight, so bear with me on those yet.

-TomH

POST ADDENDUM- Hmmm, guess I just answered my own query as to origins of this BBL!

South African 7.62mm Bren | Weapons OnLine

[Peter Laidler]

I don't know for sure but it LOOKS like a South African 7.62mm barrel from the flash eliminator. The breech end isn't compatible with a .303" breech block because it isn't recessed at the top of the breech face for the overhanging feed horns. The recess is for the extractor.

[Brian Dick]

It's a South African barrel. I'm not sure they will even interchange in an Enfield L4 gun. Peter?? I helped deact a half dozen of the S/A conversions in '09 in Essex with Terry Abrams. I was intrigued by them but have to agree with Peter after finding a legit registered post sample here in the USA. There's no comparison.

[Peter Laidler]

By deepening the magazine well of the .303" guns to accommodate the smaller base rim diameter of the 7.62's has effectively taken the strength out of the magazine support *** feed lips in the body. Just as it did with the L4A1's. MUCH more to it than that of course.........

[TactAdv]

Hey guys.....let me back up and try to clarify things on my plans here a bit. First off, this is a plan for a 'hobbyist' shooter, I'm not too keenly interested in what an Military/National conversion plan was, or the depth to which such (well funded) entity came to a level of success or failure as a result of such attempt(s).

Where I am here, we burn ammo for fun, only. We shoot dirt and dynamite. Nobody shoots back, well, not intentionally at least. So we can tolerate a substantial amount of "non-standard engineering" results. Basic safety issues are the point of questioning, not so much reliability from a soldier's field expectations. Half of the MG's I am currently shooting were in the not so distant past a pile of torch cut pieces, so there is some tolerance built in to the game.

Now, my Bren is a factory original '42 Daimler MkII machine gun- still select-fire, never cut, never modified, so the amount of any future modifications I am willing to entertain is about nil. If I can hang it on the gun without cutting, milling, or drilling......it's a go, or at least I will give it a try. That said, "caliber conversions" for me in this sense is limited to what parts I can cobble together to make it run in any particular non-.303 chambering at a time. (Peter....I can see the look of abject horror on you from over here.)

If needed to reach a specific end result, I can torch, weld, cut, mill, drill, or otherwise manually or CNC machine anything I need to. This is just my first foray into Brit guns......I've spent most of my experience on other countries guns, so this Brit stuff is new to me, but not the basic education.

I am planning, after extensive due diligence following other people's reported results thereof on the various attempts, on using this SA 7,62mm BBL modified as needed to fir and function with an original .303 bolt, feeding 7,62/.308 cartridges through an unmodifed ZB-39 magazine, and not touching my guns' receiver at all, save for possibly the locking shoulder if needed. I am planning on "de-horning" the std .303 bolt so that milled flush with the front face of the bolt, it will mate up with the SA 7,62mm BBL face. Minus that, I will be cutting the rear face of said SA BBL to mimic the std .303 BBL face to accept the horns. Either way, LOTS of measuring and pre-planning to come before the cutting of either.

Will start with the currently installed locking shoulder, see where we are with that once the bolt face and BBL are mated. I can make a new one to any length needed, if needed.

Fit of the BBL itself is not an issue, I have lots of NOS BBL shims ( 2 sizes), and NOS Mk 3 BBL lock levers of several sizes (Nos. 1,2,3,5), and worse case I can turn down one for a custom fit.

I am not worried about getting a "correct" fit from these disparate parts as I can custom size any arrangement needed. I -DO- wish I could find original "Bren-specific" chambering gauges somewhere, though.......

The ZB-39 mags seem to hold a full 25rds of .308 ammo just fine, no problems so far. There is no need, zero, to do any serious surgery just to fit a "7,62mm magazine" to this project gun, the ZB mags run the 7,62 ammo well enough and they fit my particular gun perfectly, even using the std .303 mag latch.

Last issue, or maybe not, is the use of the std ejector......not worried.
-TomH

[Brit plumber]

I believe the SA conversions used a modified .303 block by removing the horns and pressing/silver soldering an insert into the bolt face for the reduced diameter of the 7.62mm so you have no issues there. I have no idea about the ZB39 mags with 7.62mm but it's well worth a try, nothing to lose! What I do find unusual is that you say that the ZB39 mags will fit your Daimler Mk2, I seam to remember that none of my my ZB39 mags will fit any of my .303 Brens and I think this has been mentioned before and Kev G confirmed it. Could it be heavily worn?

[TactAdv]

What I do find unusual is that you say that the ZB39 mags will fit your Daimler Mk2, I seam to remember that none of my my ZB39 mags will fit any of my .303 Brens and I think this has been mentioned before and Kev G confirmed it. Could it be heavily worn?

Well, I am clueless on that point....all I can do is post up some pics showing my gun fitted with the ZB-39 mag, and fitting perfectly I might add, as a "drop in" fit. See below. I forgot to mention that my gun came with a very ersatz style of magazine catch, also pictured. All I can tell you is with THAT mag catch in place, ZB-39's snap in easily and are held perfectly in place, no wobble at all, just perfect. They slip right out too. I have no idea where that mag catch came from, so if anyone has any ideas, I'm all ears.

I am also re-posting a couple pics of the outside of the receiver to let you judge general "wear" of it?? It looks pretty "un-worn" to me!
-TomH