Springfield or what?

[Voltigeur]

Hi all, I'm a new member and I'm a young collector

I was looking for my first US rifle (not so easy here in Italy) and I've found this one; the seller present it as Springfield but I can't find helpful information on the net.

Could you help me understanding "whatisit" ?

Thank you
Andrea

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Patrick Chadwick]

At first glance, it does not look like a Springfield rifle.
1) It looks like a "drum and nipple" conversion of some kind of flintlock. Which leads to the next question:
2) Is it a real rifle - does it have rifling? Or is it a smoothbore?
3) What is the bore diameter?
4) The backsight is in a style found more commonly on Swiss and German rifles, and the Peabody. Not on a Springfield.
5) The bayonet was not necessarily original to the rifle. There were many bayonet types, often very similar. To narrow down the options please provide a photo of the complete bayonet socket. And please note that a possible identification of the bayonet does not identify the rifle.
6) US on the lockplate is not sufficient to prove it is a US lockplate. It is too easy to fake, and a genuine military lockplate should have more markings on it than just US - for instance, an eagle and "Springfield" below the US.

Better photos are required - of any residual markings on the lockplate, of the ENTIRE rifle, of the INSIDE of the lock, of ANY markings on the barrel, of the buttplate, of the other side of the backsight...

It MIGHT be a conversion of a US flintlock musket, but it is too early to be sure.
If it is a conversion, then 1854 is presumably the date of the conversion, not of original manufacture.

[gsimmons]

It looks like a model 1812 musket converted to percussion and rifled in the 1850's. That style of rear sight is not very common on conversion muskets.
Patrick, the V P and eagle head on the breach are U.S. proof marks.

---------- Post added at 07:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 AM ----------

It also looks like someone polished the p*** out of it. If the price is right I'd have it as it's kind of a rare or uncommon musket. I'll try to look it up tonight.

[Voltigeur]

Thank you Patrick, I have some answer

2. I think that has been rifled during conversion
3. bore diameter drive me to propose a .69 caliber
5. fot me too the bayonet is not original to the rifle
6. on the lockplate there are eagle and "Sprin [...] ld" but both are quite erased

I'll try to have better picture as soon as I can

---------- Post added at 02:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:47 PM ----------

It looks like a model 1812 musket converted to percussion and rifled in the 1850's. That style of rear sight is not very common on conversion muskets.
Patrick, the V P and eagle head on the breach are U.S. proof marks.

---------- Post added at 07:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 AM ----------

It also looks like someone polished the p*** out of it. If the price is right I'd have it as it's kind of a rare or uncommon musket. I'll try to look it up tonight.

Thank you, for me too has been heavily polished, I'll try to post better pictures

[gsimmons]

According vol. II of George Moller's American Shoulder Arms its a type II model 1812 musket.