Which model No 4 best for target work?

[Thunderbox]

I wouldn't think that there is the slightest chance of obtaining a "most accurate" rifle by making a choice based on model or manufacturer. There is no statistical evidence at all that supports any sort of correlation, let alone the data set and laboratory research that might be needed to even detect variations due to metallurgy or machining patterns.

Shooting performance of the rifle is purely down to bore condition and bedding. Again, there is no evidence that any of the well-known gunsmiths were doing anything to a No4 other than selecting a decent barrel and making sure the forend was a good fit. If there was a "secret formula", presumably we'd by now all know that "X's SRb model can reliably shoot 1/4 moa" etc. On the contrary, if you look at dozens of Fultons SRb No4s, they are a complete bag of bitsas - many are made from mixed manufacturer parts.

[Beerhunter]

If the sole objective was easier manufacture, why did they bother converting all those Mk.1/2 and 1/3's? That exercise undoubtedly took a fair amount of skill and time. Hmmmm. . .

The conversions were done during FFR.

[Peter Laidler]

Once again, what a breath of fresh air, common sense and the bleedin obvious Thunderbox comes up with.

I'm sure Beery really means FTR and not FFR - Fitted For Radio!. But as he says, once a Mk1 had been converted to Mk1/2, it is IMMEDIATELY not the cause of a bottleneck during the assembly stage.

[Beerhunter]

You are right Peter. I did mean FTR. And what palaver those petrol-powered Truck, Rover 4X4 FFRs were. Not as bad as the Champ (yes I am that old) but so many odd parts and a 24v system to boot.

[Seaspriter]

During the production run for the No.4 Mk2, there were a number of special orders with these serial numbers:
PP1 PP43 Parker Hale 43
PF 361160 PF 361259 Parker Hale 99
PF 401087 PF 401495 No 4 (T) Rifles? 408
PF 401157 PF 404206 Parker Hale 3049
PF 405813 PF 405848 G E Fulton (Bisley) 35
PF 411229 PF 411264 G E Fulton (Bisley) 35

Would these be likely candidates to start choosing an accurate target rifle. (Several months ago one of the Parker Hale rifles with IIRC a PH5 sight sold or $475 USD.)

[Peter Laidler]

I'm bound to ask what difference would there be in these rifles to a standard Fazakerley made Army issue Mk2 rifle of the era. Fazakerley is to gun making is what King Herod is to baby-sitting circles

[CINDERS]

Nothing special with my No.4's except one is hard bedded with no movement of the muzzle and both shoot better than I as I am looking at a score from a 200M shoot we had a while ago I was using 174gn SMK's from the sitting position with the hard bedded one and it reads V V V V V V V 5 4 4 - 48.07 & V 5 5 5 5 V V V 5 5 - 50.04 = 98.11/100.20 also I finished 2nd in the state championships 2 years running a 2 day shoot using my a Spec - 1 as issued No.4 the courses of fire were from 100 - 600M prone, sitting and standing. I think there is an element of luck, skill and just being on your mettle on the day. The chap that won both those years was shooting a 1915 Lithgow No 1 Mk III and is still hard to beat and whats worse he has just brought another 1915 Lithgow
Here is what goes pretty much for all of us, I look at things that make a rifle what it is, does the bolt move freely, rip it apart with the owners permission and get a good look at the marking and o/all condition of the bottom wood and the draws and bearing 2 2/3rds around the mag well, if the back of the bottom wood is cracked where the plate is then this needs a fixin. Barrels are barrels but a good one that accepts a 295.5 - 300 is pretty tight look at the crown for dings and then the ol bore scope up the pipe to check the throat and over all condition don't want a rusty ford up there do we, check the stock comes together it should not rock on the trigger guard screw front when tightened right up means the collar is too long between the screw head and the seat, though at times the screw will bottom out before the action is tight in the wood, all being good boil the barrel hot steaming water do not burn yourself use 2x1.5l kettle fulls swab out till dry it will dry quickly but gotta get the water out. While still warmish cane it with Hoppes No 9 or Coppa Killer by Montana do 2 cleanings, swab out with metho let dry then lightly oil the bore and other items bit of BLO in the wood fit sling a box of crackers and hey range time this is of course the F pin protrusion is ok and the bolt over turn is no more than 5 degrees and it head spaces on a .067 is what I use others use a .070 both as go gauges and the .074 as the no go. I did here there was a rule a .074 H/S weapon could be shot but only in the event the cooks tent was going to over run by the enemy best powder I use is AR2209 between 40gns+ a tich more not much though the AR2208 is just a bit to sharp, anyway have a good time there is plenty of helpful chaps here, by the way use FED-210 primers and Rem cases Have fun........

[Richard Hare]

Thanks for all the interest and time taking in replies chaps.

So it appears beauty is where you find it, or in this case accuracy.
No preference of Mk 1 over Mk 2, or anything.

For Years we were told that the No 4 made the better target rifle, but in the last while, it has come to light how well the old SMLE can perform, as seen in Cinders thread above, (Thanks for that!) And, as seen in results at long range, they still seem hard to beat!

Have a 1923 Lithgow, FTR'd in '54. Not tried it much yet...

Thank you again,
Richard.

[newcastle]

Interestingly. for years my most accurate Enfield was a bitsa No.4 Longbranch. However a few years back i bought a REALLY rough REALLY cheap 1915 Lithgow from Brian Dick for what was going to be a refurb / sniper / bubba project (NOTE : Brian doesn't sell rough rifles. I actually had to plead to see if he had any old beaters specifically and he found this one for me that he had been saving for a project himself). I decided to shoot it before tinkering and Lo and behold it was simply fabulous so i abandoned the project. It has a really stiff action and bolt - maybe tolerances were particularly tight that year or something.

Middle group of these three at 100 yards from testing ammo. That group was Sellier and bellot ammo as it likes that (IIRC top was POF and bottom might have been some old Radway Green - but twas very hangfirey).
Attachment 64149

[Mk VII]

If you are old enough, it should be FFW.

You are right Peter. I did mean FTR. And what palaver those petrol-powered Truck, Rover 4X4 FFRs were. Not as bad as the Champ (yes I am that old) but so many odd parts and a 24v system to boot.