Fake Rockola cartouche?

[AD-4NA]

Saw a Rockola carbine with final acceptance stamps that piqued my attention the other day.

No only was the ordnance wheel and "RMC" stamped suspiciously evenly, deeply, freshly and sized too large, but it was stamped so deeply that it showed that the crossed cannons and letters used were all on one giant stamp, many inches wide. I can't remember whether there was even anything in the sling well.

I am pretty sure this was never originally the case right?

There were a number of other things wrong with the carbine in addition that pointed to someone trying and failing to "improve" the carbine or assemble an obvious fake, such as an early sight but stake marks consistent with an adjustable sight on the dovetail, barrel band, and more, but the stock stuck out at me the most.

And no, I can't get pictures. It's at a touchy store and I don't want to tick them off about the fakery.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Snowman1510]

If the store is touchy about photos and that kind of stuff, that would send up a red flag to me.

[browningautorifle]

I don't want to tick them off

I wouldn't even worry about it. That sort of info is something you keep in your head unless they ask you. I was asked not long ago about a #4 Lee Enfield and gave him the whole rundown on it. A parts gun... If they need to know then you can let them know.

[Sunray]

Touchy stores don't stay in business for long. Worst thing they can do is throw you out.
Mind you, 'one giant stamp' wouldn't be cost effective to have made. And lots of well known refinishing shops think nothing of charging for whatever cartouche stamps you want.

[painter777]

Fake Rockola cartouche?
Saw a Rockola carbine with final acceptance stamps that piqued my attention

I'm just trying to cover the stock stamps. Lord knows there are more than enough carbines out there with attempts at making them look original.
You'll see Examples of these Faked Stamps most every day in auctions. Here is one completed auction of a NEW MADE stock, with long barrel channel and REPRODUCED STAMPS (I Believe a Dupage stock). It sold for $290.00. The seller revealed it was Reproduction Stamped.
Here is the Completed Auction link : WW2 M1 Carbine Stock Handguard ROCKOLA | eBay

Sellers description below:

Up for bidding is a beautiful M1 carbine stock and hand guard made of walnut. The stock and hand guard are in excellent restored condition with no cracks or splits. The main body of the stock is a reproduction, the hand guard, and metal are 70+ years old made during WW2. This stock has been test-fitted with my own carbine, and fits and functions fine,.... This stock comes with a WW2 hand guard, WW2 Rockola butt plate, WW2 recoil plate stamped "Rockola" on top, and WW2 band spring. All photos are of the actual stock you will be getting. Please examine all photos carefully for a complete description. If you have any questions please ask before bidding. This stock would be great as a wall hanger, or as a shooter while you wait for that WW2 complete original...
INCLUDED
WW2 Recoil plate stamped ROCK-OLA
WW2 Early Hand guard stamped "RMC"
Walnut reproduction stock
WW2 butt plate manufactured by Rockola
Cartouche re-stamping
"P" on pistol grip


Reproduction / Fake Stamp


Long Barrel Channel on a I Cut Hi-Wood Stock..... Not in WWII

it showed that the crossed cannons and letters used were all on one giant stamp

The REAL Rock Ola with Crossed Cannons Stamp were a one piece stamp and often left a outer line impression when stamped. Most I've seen often (when it occurs) leave that impression at the bottom, below the Cannons. Example below.....

FWIW,
Charlie-Painter777

[AD-4NA]

Hmm, now I might need to take another look at that poor chewed up old thing.


Yes, I learned to keep silent while inside a shop a long time ago...

On that front, touchy stores do sometimes stay in business when they are big box retailers, sometimes with grumpy and occasionally inept old men in charge!

[USGI]

I'm not seeing the "long" barrel channel. The nose of the stock is "funny" shaped, though. - Bob

[painter777]

Hey Bob,
Your right...
I believe looking at that Bulbous nose threw me off. Should be more wood behind where the band spring goes in.

Like this Winchester:

[USGI]

Charlie, I happen to own (it's a long story) a stock very similar to your eBay example above. It's got the same blunt nose, but it's an oval cut rather than an "I." Someone put Underwood acceptance markings on it and stamped MU in the slingwell. Another thing it has is the bomb marking behind the recoil plate, same as on this picture of the eBay stock. What can you tell me about that marking? I don't recall seeing it before. I thought maybe it was supposed to be an Underwood "thing" and was going to look it up at some point, but never have. Know anything about those? Thanks! - Bob

[painter777]

Bob,
Well you got me doing your homework again for you, since you know I'm laid up with the shoulder problems.......... Taking advantage of the crippled guy.... Geeezzzee.

Your's looks like those small Repro Bomb Shell stamps.
The common one I've see have no flame licks and are often on stocks that have the boxed RIA over EB stamped stocks, So is it something RIA added? I'm not sure, because we've run across stocks that had no acceptance stamps/CC's but had the bomb by the recoil plate, Maybe replacement stocks when accepted were stamped with it?
I know Frank 'The Foot' Derrico has run across quite a few also.



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