Black Army 1911?

[GUTS]

I fellow from around here wants to sell this 1911 for $2500. I am not as smart on 1911's as some of you are so I need your advice on whether I should buy it or not. I took it apart and tried to take some decent photos but it's tough to get the right light sometimes. The untouched finish inside the frame is black. The finish that is left looks black to the eye and seems to have the "flaking" that usually happens as the finish wears down. The rear sight and the recoil spring guide are from an A1 but the rest of the parts seem correct. I believe the non-heart cut reciever is correct for this serial range. The slide, frame and the barrel have the complete serial number on them. The thing I find strange is the lack of a U.S. PROPERTY stamp on the left side of the frame and also no eagle head inspector stamp and they have not been removed so was it never issued? The 2-tone magazine is a nice bonus.

[GUTS]

I have been looking at the frame where the U.S.PROPERTY and the eagle proof should be and I can't find any sign of abraisive removal of them. I used very good magnification and I can't see any difference in the metal finish.

[Sapper740]

Yes, there were blackened 1911s made during WWI and are fairly rare and pricey. The frame on this Colt looks like it's been buffed, the United States Property is missing and the frame and slide look like they have different finishes. 6 years ago Colt did a small run of 'vintage' blackened 1911s which sold for $1,000 but I've heard of all original blackened WWI 1911s selling for $6,000 to $7,000.

[GUTS]

I don't know how deep roll marks are but I only have a difference of .1mm in the wall thickness of that area of the frame.

[GUTS]

I noted in my first post that the eagle stamp and the U.S.PROPERTY marks are missing. I have a 1911 that is only 10,000 numberrs away from this one and the U.S.PROPERTY mark is rudley ground off but the eagle stamp is there. If you closley at the pictures you can see that the flaking on the frame stops right where the flat milling starts but looking closely the wear comes up on the shiney flat part of the frame also. The wear on the serial number looks to be from charging the slide over the years. The black finish was so fragile and crappy on these guns I would wonder if you could polish it without it coming right off. The roll marks most likely were removed and it re-finished in black but the flaking on the top and bottom of the pistol looks period correct to me. The problem for my thinking being the only circumstance I could think of that would make it possible to have this pistol without U.S.PROPERTY and an Eagle S proof would be if it was stolen from the Colt factory before it made it to a military inspection area which isn't verly likely.

[GUTS]

I'm going to offer him $1200.

[Sapper740]

I'm going to offer him $1200.

That's a steal if you can get it for that. I have a rough 1911 serial #186XXX that I wouldn't sell for $1200.

[oldfoneguy]

I would want to see a Colt archive letter accompany the pistol for that kind of money. That would benefit both the seller and you should you purchase the pistol. Any original destination other than a US arsenal or military base will tell the tale.

Speaking for myself if I was offered less than half my asking price for an item I'm selling wouldn't even rate a response. That would indicate to me that the buyer either wasn't serious about the purchase or can't afford the item and is daydreaming.

[GUTS]

I explained to him about the value loss for the rubbed out roll marks and he said $1700 is as low as he will go.

[MAC702]

I just checked my "No 359395" Black Army. Has the same patent dates on the slide, but no rampant colt in between them; It was moved to above the safety notch by this time. All that remains of the frame rollmark on the dust cover is a light "UNITED___________PERTY"