"Pre" topic question- Remington Lees

[jmoore]

:

As a matter of interest, at Warminster, we have the actual LEE purchased in order to ascertain the suitability of the bolt action, magazine feed and trigger mechanism. It's in a glass case now, a bit battered and worn but it's the actual rifle.

It's together with the last service Lee Enfield in service with the British Army. And suprisingly, it's not a No4 or L42 but a No1 Mk3*. I suppose ther are still LEE's, in the form of thousands of No8's still in service but......

I tell visitors that being a hallowed name, they should gently genuflect when they pass by........... and to the mighty Brens of course!

Question: Which trials Lee? The .45" 1879 model, the "improved" Lee .45", or the .43" improved Lee which was tried first w/o a mag cutoff, then upgraded to the Lee-Speed? There were others, but that's what comes to mind now...

Anyway, it would be most awesome if it actually is the very first sample sent over!:: (Which would be a Sharps-Lee, I think)

[jmoore]

Well, folks, "someone" kindly answered my question, probably before I asked!

The rifle on display at Warminster is an 1882/85 .43" Spanish cal. w/ the magazine cutoff modification. It appears to have a standard Lee single column magazine.

At the risk of getting slapped upside the head, here's where it was found:

Infantry and SASC Weapons Collection. The Remington Lee Rifle of 1885

Now if only I knew in what serial number range it was....Exciting stuff, if you're a "gun geek"!

Thanks loads, y'all!!!

[ireload2]

A little birdie told me that the bolt diameter of an original 1885 in .43 Spanish was .638 (16.21mm) so it must have been reduced in size for the British version of the Lee.

[jmoore]

Yee Blxxdy Ha!

Shot the 1879 45-70 US Navy Lee this morning! (PMC brass 405 gr lead bullet)

Impressions:

SMOOOOOOTH action (maybe moreso than a well used SMLE)

Crisp single stage trigger

Sights OK but it shoots about 6" right at 100yd 3-4" 5-shot groups. No 200yd or more yet.

Bolt handle not too far forward.

FUN (Did I mention smooth action? Its also really fast cycling!)

!!!!!! More later

[GeneM]

A friend just alerted me to this thread on the Remington Lees and the Springfield Lee. I have one of these - Serial # 72 - marked on the breech block and wrote an article on it that was published in the Feb. 2006 Man At Arms Magazine. I did a test firing of it (with apologies to Paul Scarlata whose firing tests makes his articles most interesting) and found out that a heavy glove is needed to prevent impaling my right palm. It is fast but I did not try to duplicate Lee's feat of 30 shots in 3/4 of a minute. Officially 143 of the rifles were made at a cost of $10,000 that was appropriated by Congress in 1874, however, Springfield Armory reported that 145 were made at a cost of $10,332.66. It is not known why the difference between the Armory report and the Chief of Ordnance report.

I also show in the article the cutaway breech mechanism that was used to demonstrate the action of an earlier version before the 1872 board.

She who has proofread my books and articles for the past 48 years will be obeyed and we will be in Atlantic City. No rifles or MGA sports car for the next week. They will have a good airshow all day over the boardwalk on Wednesday.

GeneM
Author
The Remington-Lee Rifle
The Winchester-Lee Rifle

[ireload2]

Gene,
Thanks for the information on your article. I look forward to reading it and looking at the photos.

[snorli]

A bit off the "pre" topic: Here's a couple of (rather poor) pictures of one of my Lees. In 1886-87 about 540 Lee troop trial repeating rifles no 1 ("Forsøgsrepetergevær nr 1") were made at the Copenhagen Arsenal in 8mmx58R calibre. They were made in two types, with and without cut-off.
They were not adopted by the Danish, who went for the Norwegian Krag-Jørgensen design instead.
Only a small number (about 25 is known) have survived.

[jmoore]

Actually, that's the first Danish Lee I've ever heard of! I reckon when I don't learn something new its time to quit!

Suppose its time to buy a couple of books (Thanks, Gene)

[Peter Laidler]

Gene M. If I send you some relevant details of our Lee at Warminster, will/can you give us a bit more background info please. Thanks. Specifically, what info do YOU require?

Thanks

[GeneM]

snorli,
Yours is the first Danish Trials Lee I have seen. I very briefly mention the Danish Trials in the Remington Lee book but had no information on them. It is a most rare rifle. Question - are there any markings on the receiver? I wonder if the original Remington Lee Model 1882 receiver, bolt, trigger guard and magazine were used rather than machining the parts in Denmark.


Peter,
I corresponded with the late Herb J. Woodend, Custodian of the Pattern Room starting in 1993 while working on the Remington Lee book. He provided me with the serial numbers of some of the Remington Lees in the collection. He noted that some were relative recent additions to the collection including a .75 caliber Chinese Jingal single shot based on the Model 1882. He provided me with pictures of the Remington Lee British Trials Rifle with the magazine cutoff. I will have to dig in my files and locate the correspondence files. It will be interesting to see if the rifles still exist.

Mr. Woodend was a fine gentleman and I regret not meeting him in person. His letters were a source of interest to our local postmistress as they came in an official envelope marked ON HER MAJESTY'S SERVICE . James Bond was a popular movie at the time and I joked with Herb about adding SECRET to the envelope heading.

The Atlantic City airshow was fanatastic - started at 11 AM and wound up at 4 PM with an hour long show by the USAF Thunderbirds.

GeneM