Essay on British army new sniper rifle ....

[Brian Dick]

Well said Mk.VII. A bolt action rifle can be just as efficient for quick follow-up shots as a semi-auto IF the soldier/sniper is properly trained and practiced. Many of the gadgets and weapons being designed and fielded today are supposed to make up for what's a simple lack of training. It was that way during my service in the U.S. Army in the 80's and it's much worse now. Hell, I did more shooting on weekends in my spare time than I ever did while active in a U.S. Army PIR.

[Peter Laidler]

Rapid follow-up shots are only taught as a self defence mechanism. In a 'which of the five will I take out' scenario, then it'd be a job for the 81mm mortar crews......... a job that they'd relish. And if the 81 was already dug in, you can be sure that 'the five' wouldn't be going home to mum for breakfast

[Ngib]

The weapons I was referring to are the German super sniper rifles such as the AMP Technical Services DSR-1HK MSG90 or the PSG-1- PSG1A1 and the Walther 2000. these are not full auto but have the option of a fast second shot. Consider if Lee Harvey Oswald had been armed with a semi auto AMP Technical Services DSR-1 instead of a 6.5 millimetre Italian carbine with a four-power scope when he supposedly assassinated President Kennedy on Dealey Plaza.

[gunner]

The option to have a fast second shot is o.K. and gives you a good feeling about a bit more security. But normaly if you missed your target, the fast second shot is not an good option in that case. It depend on the reason why you missed the target( movement, to high to low...) a fast second can give your hide away in a special case. The normal case to act on a battlefield with all the action will cover your second shot in the noise of the action. But a military sniper dont act only at battlefields. And for the option that you will be attacked by your oponents, i think a good guided rifle fire and the help from your teammate will be a also good solution. And an eventually option for an artillery call in or an air strike as stated in the posts above are good too. But this will be a worst case scenario. You`re right with the rifles, they are good, but i like my bolt action, maybe for the reason that i am a bit nostalgic.

Regards

Gunner

[jmoore]

Consider if Lee Harvey Oswald had been armed with a semi auto AMP Technical Services DSR-1 instead of a 6.5 millimetre Italian carbine with a four-power scope when he supposedly assassinated President Kennedy on Dealey Plaza.

How dead is dead? Seemed to be up to the task! I've an exact duplicate that shoots mighty well at the short ranges required at Deely Plaza...

[Ngib]

You`re right with the rifles, they are good, but i like my bolt action, maybe for the reason that i am a bit nostalgic.

Regards

Gunner

The problem is the whole of the USA -UK -Aussie-Kiwi armies are nostalgic.

Even the Mexicans use a full auto German H&K PSG1A1.

[trooper554877]

Rapid follow-up shots are only taught as a self defence mechanism. In a 'which of the five will I take out' scenario, then it'd be a job for the 81mm mortar crews......... a job that they'd relish. And if the 81 was already dug in, you can be sure that 'the five' wouldn't be going home to mum for breakfast

What is taught and what is practiced for real is sometimes different. Yes the brits stayed with the SR98 but i bet there are a few snipers there who wish they had a semi auto for that quick nail him before he disappears down the drain pipe or past that alleyway.

Yes they could call for fire on a static to partially moving target. But when I was in mortars we rarely fired a mission for one man which if the sniper was going to engage more than one or two , he then has to think about bugging out or he is confident he is outa range of returning fire or his position is totally concealled.
The Pam is fine for what it is intended to be, that is a training aid, too many people have been killed when insistant officers or NCO's say this has to be done by the Pam. Probably why us aussies get into so much hot water because of this. And now I am expecting the same for this.
Cheers
NED
Ngib
mate you have some good ideas and from your posts have done the deal I hope, most others here haven't. So I take your considerations under adviement. Just remember that some systems or individuals don't like being told they are wrong or there is a better way to do it.

[villiers]

The weapons I was referring to are the German super sniper rifles such as the AMP Technical Services DSR-1HK MSG90 or the PSG-1- PSG1A1 and the Walther 2000. these are not full auto but have the option of a fast second shot. Consider if Lee Harvey Oswald had been armed with a semi auto AMP Technical Services DSR-1 instead of a 6.5 millimetre Italian carbine with a four-power scope when he supposedly assassinated President Kennedy on Dealey Plaza.

I was taught (many years ago) that if the first round missed .... not to hang around but to b*gger off quite sharply!

[Peter Laidler]

I just get a strange, almost funny feeling in my bones, that many who have answered this thread lately haven't been snipers or haven't ever been on the sniping course. While the good sound basics remain the same (probably the world over) such as camouflage and concealment, intelligence, stalking to kill etc etc the battlefield now isn't the same as it was 20 yars ago on the European plain and the enemy we're up against certainly isn't as well educated or trained. And I don't want to be cruel or insensitive, but some of 'em just sit there like startled rabbits....................

The current batches of snipers would do anyone proud. They're taught to be cunning, cautious and clever....., just sit and wait and the quarry will always come back................. Some of 'em even come back to take a peek with their binos. But not twice!

I would just like to take a tiny issue with the notion that the Mortars wouldn't (or would rarely) fire a mission for a man at the request of the sniper team. I can assure you that the right man is ALWAYS worth 2 mortar bombs. In fact you have probably seen that very event taking place! A small small group spotted by the snipers (intelligence again...) causing a bit of upset among the lads WILL bring in a Milan or a Javelin. As I see on the side of the milan cases 1 Milan = less trouble!

NGIB. First you decide what you WANT to do, then decide what you REALLY NEED to do, then design the ammo to do the job, then design the rifle that can send the round accurately to the target to do the job.

[trooper554877]

All agreed Peter,
the right man would deserve the fire for effect.
its all theorys and suppositions on the screen. It all changes sometimes at the coal face.
OUT
Cheers
NED