A Strange (and somewhat cobbled) No.4 Mk.2

[jmoore]

The last No4's from Fazakerley were breeched up with breeching up washers. These were available in the Armourers system too

Yes, I'd be happy if that were the case, but this Long Branch barrel is installed (and "toight", too!) w/ a 0.005" or 0.006" shim. Poor practice, from what little I've read...

[Peter Laidler]

Yes, the later breeching up washers were L42 type thickness.

Unless I'm mstaken, it was the BSA machinery that went to Pakistan wasn't it? I wrote this up some time ago after consulting another person who knows these things. The BSA machinery was redundant after the last MoS orders because BSA were simply commercial contractors and the property rights to manufacture belonged to the Government.

The ROF6 Sterling production machinery was sold off to the Sterling Company who used it to make commercial killing with Sterling SMG's and the rifle machinery and bonded items went into secure MoS storeage at a former ex RAF Bomb Dump near xxxxxxxxx where it just rotted out I presume following a couple of decades of 'care and maintenance only' A huge swathe of the .303 ammunition manufacturing machinery also went into storage there only to meet the same fate. The remaining No4 bodies were........... and on and on! But some of these bodies were in poor condition when they were brought out for conversion.

As I have said several times. In the UK MoD/MoS system, (unlike Canada) for security reasons, the body was NEVER available as a replacement part, even to overseas governments. I can only assume that this body found itself 'liberated' (not difficult in Liverpool.....) and thereafter, made up into a rifle and then..................

Even today (?), 'liberated' and un-numbered ALBION made No2 revolvers are the mainstay of the Glasgow underworld

[jmoore]

Found another one that's quite similar to the rifle originally posted, except this one has a '48 barrel, a converted No.4 Mk.1 forend to Mk.2 spec., and a No.5 trigger guard. ( No skinny breeching shim this time.)

Number is 4/1095.

No FTR marks. And again no sign of ever having had Fazackerly engaving on the receiver(body) side wall.

It also has a Long Branch bolt with 4/1095 UNDER the bolt handle. Have it bring held at at local shop until we come to a price. Not a "pretty" rifle again! Very odd.

[sakorick]

I love oddballs like this. Peter, I thought Pakistan bought all the Faz tooling and spares? This could easily be a cobbled Pakistani and now there is another example.....did either have import marks? The chase for information is 1/2 the fun! Great stuff. Regards, Rick.

By the way, it's good to be back here on the forum!

[Peter Laidler]

It was the BSA tooling that was disposed of. BSA had the tooling supplied to them by the Ministry of Supply. It was to be maintained, at cost by the MoS during its life and retained on a care and maintenance basis for a further 10 years - to 1955! When they had reached the end of their obligation, owned it - and promptly sold it off. The area was cleared and following a bit of upheaval and xxse kicking and sheer frustration at the Fazakerley workforce, the space recently vacated by the redundant No4 machinery at BSA was filled with L1A1 production machinery.......... from Fazakerley. Fazakerley limped on doing their best to make Sterling SMG's but dear oh dear....., it was like pulling teeth............

The Fazakerley No4 machinery stuff was the latest Mk2 kit - used but serviceable and kept because this could be quickly brought into use to make No4's should an emergency or other need arise

[Surpmil]

Labour troubles you mean Peter, or just general Ludditeism and laziness?

The communists were deeply interested in disrupting UK arms factories of course.

Can't think of the title just now, but I have a nice little volume by one of their former organizers that lays out the whole thing.

[bradtx]

jmoore, Good luck on your 'quest'. It took me three years and multiple posts to finally learn about my twin Maltbys. FWIW, and for no particular reason I think it was a cadet rifle.

Brad

[jmoore]

Well, I found my record of the one I sold- but The only further hard info on it is that it was marked, in addition to the "4/xxx", UF55 A33309.
Was it ever completely assembled at Fazackerly? And then promptly made a "mixmaster"? It seems unlikely... Parts clean-up receiver methinks.

Had I thought there would be more coming my way I might have kept it, or at least made better notes!

Need to get the new one home. Things keep coming up- like work-68hrs this week at least.

[Maxwell Smart]

What is the quick identifier as to the rifle body being a late Fazakerley?

Is it the "scoop" of metal out of the receiver side - down below where the "US PROPERTY" mark is on a Savage rifle?

[jmoore]

What is the quick identifier as to the rifle body being a late Fazakerley?

Is it the "scoop" of metal out of the receiver side - down below where the "US PROPERTY" mark is on a Savage rifle?

No, but almost by definition, a British No.4 Mk.2 IS a Fazackerly, because they were the last British No.4 producer.

There are early and late No.4 Mk.2s as well- the main difference being the removal of the old magazine cutoff latch lug on the RH front of the receiver body and the extra wood in the fore stock which fills the "hole".