WW2 97 Trench gun question

[Jared]

These last three are pictures of proofing, and serials of my 50's vintage Model 12 riot gun that is nearly new condition. Notice the lack of burnishing or halos around the proofs and numbers...

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[Jared]

I seem to have some good picture conditions right now so here are few more pictures of the trench gun showing the perfect wood to metal fit on the bottom tang, the old grease under the heat shield, butt plate, etc. Thoughts please...
Jared V

[John Ed]

Jared,

I have S/N 93034X in similar condition.
Mine has a "Pat.Appl For " bayonet adapter. The stock however was unmarked.
This may open up a can of worms but I do subscribe to the Winchester rework theory. I own a Model 12 riot that is U.S. marked with similar Punch Marks.

The blue is consistant to that of other Winchesters I own. Hopefully records will turn up someday of any Winchester Rework. Who knows maybe with a list os Serial Numbers !

[Jared]

Thanks for the reply John. Poyer's book does state that MOST (meaning not all??) WW2 lugs were unmarked. I wouldn't mind seeing some pictures of your gun. Does your trench gun have the punch marks as pictured above?
Jared V.

[John Ed]

Jared,

Yes it does have the "Punch Marks" like yours.

If I may suggest you should invest in Bruce Canfield's book on Combat Shotguns. Well worth the money.
I even found reference to the Winchester Rework on pg. 119 right had side of the page.
Contract #W-19-059 for repairs of model 97 and model 12 shotguns. Total combined number of guns 30,000. I feel confident that the employees did not try to match up the WWI bayonet adapters to WWI guns etc. So it is very possible.

[Rob13]

I am sure that if the Winchester factory had a supply of heat shields in stock and some of them were marked ones like early ones, they would not have said, "Dang it, look marked heat shields, throw those in the scrap pile and lets make unmarked ones to use.!" I collect old phones and have more than enough to tell that they mixed parts when they changed/built different versions. They used up the parts on hand, so you might see one phone with a certain ringer and a different hook that was built while in transition to newer similar version. Some phones still have the old unused holes that were predrilled in the wood for earlier parts, but made with the newer parts that used different mtg methods. I know of collectors that have changed out phone parts, only to find later that they made a mistake....same with guns too.

[Jared]

Thanks for the input Rob. Does anyone know if the Cody Museum has any records on WW2 era Winchester produced arms?

[Tom Doniphon]

AFAIK, there are no Cody records for the WW2 shotguns. But, I have a source that can probably tell us when the shotgun was serialized, perhaps even the exact day. If you are interested I can try and get that info for you.

[Jared]

Tom,
I am interested. The serial is in the pictures above. Thanks,
Jared V

[SPEEDGUNNER]

I am not so sure of the stamping of the serial number on the receiver extension, doesn't look quite right...