bren MK2 sling

[Kev G]

Hi Tom
If you want any pictures put up email me and I'll upload them and send you a link.

P.S hope the roof is now fixed !

ATB Kevin

[Peter Laidler]

Blimey....... sooooooooo much about such a small and relatively insignificant bit of Bren gun kit!

[tombear]

Blimey....... sooooooooo much about such a small and relatively insignificant bit of Bren gun kit!

Ha! You should see how much I wrote on lmg cleaning brushes and on rods! This is what comes of not getting out enough...... :-(D)

ATB

Tom

---------- Post added at 04:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:56 PM ----------

Ps will get the pics over to you Kevin and the text with the titles still attached.

Cheers!

ATB

Tom

[tombear]

thanks to Kevin, heres the full document, Ill go back and delete the other version.

A short history of Bren Slings




List of Changes B 1523 of April 1938 introduced Slings, Bren Gun Cat. No. AA 1640 (Fig. 1a) comprising a standard 46 inch rifle sling Cat. No. AA 1657 and two Hooks, sling, Bren gun Cat. No. AA 1132. By LoC B 2380 which introduced the Mk I Bren and associated kit the sling was known as Slings, Bren .303-in. M.G., Mk. I. With typical perversity when various slings where transferred from Section A1 to Section C1 in LoC C 415 of June of 1944 in accordance to Army Council Instruction 36 of the same year the Bren one was listed as Slings, Bren Gun again!.




LoC B 5630 of Jan 1942 extended its use to the 2 inch mortar and made the short mortar sling (Introduced in LoC B 4510) obsolescent.








Fig.1 Long and short Bren slings




Army Council Instruction 377 of mid 1944 gave instructions for the production of the 3 part, 58 inch sling by the insertion of a 12 inch section into a standard rifle sling, using 2 brass plates and a total of 8 rivets! (Fig. 2) Officially rifle sling material was to be used but I also have a example where plain webbing tape has been used in lieu. (Fig. 3)








Fig. 2 Extended sling # 1








Fig. 3 Extended sling # 2




ACI 1327 of Dec 1945 announced that sufficient stocks of single piece 58 inch slings Cat. No. AA 5663 were available to replace all 46 inch slings still in use. It also cancelled ACI 377.




The long sling, Slings, web, 58-in., Mk. 1, Cat. No. 0737 was mentioned in LoC C 2376 issued immediately post war but with a authorisation date of November 1944 as part of Sling, Bren .303-in. M.G., No. 1 Mk. 2. Cat. No. CA 5663 (Fig. 1b)




This same LoC revised the nomenclature for the old rifle sling length Bren Sling to Slings, Bren, .303-in. M.G., No. 1, Mk. 1 and made it obsolescent and revised the nomenclature for the hook to Hooks, sling, Bren .303 M.G., Mk. 1. It goes on to explain that "these slings have been placed in a numerical series to distinguish them from the Canadian pattern slings that have only one hook fitted. Canadian pattern slings have been designated No. 2."




Hence the rifle sling length Canadian model would be Slings, Bren, .303-in. M.G., No. 2, Mk. 1 shown here with the late war none swivelling hook (Fig. 4b) and the 58 inch version Sling, Bren .303-in. M.G., No. 2 Mk. 2 .








Fig. 4 Post War long UK and Canadian short slings




Green versions of the sling were introduced late in WWII for use in the Far East and these gradually became the standard types post war. (Fig. 4a) It can be assumed that the alternate versions of the rifle sling, such as the rubber lined cotton version and the 1914 Pattern leather slings were briefly used with Bren hooks in units using that sort of sling with their rifles. Economy versions of the rifle length and 58 inch sling do exist with the grey looking, Sherendised steel fittings as opposed to brass.




LoC C 9501 of 1959 finally made the Slings, Bren, .303-in. M.G., No. 1, Mk. 1 obsolete and extended use of the No. 1 Mk. 2 to the L4A1 and A2 under the revised nomenclature of Sling, M.G., Mk 1 (Fig. 1c) Cat. No. C1/AA 5663.




LoC C 9839 of 1961 extended the use of the 58 inch sling to all the L4 series of guns and a year later extended it’s use to the L7A1 MG in LoC D 71.




The sling developed for the L7 , Sling GPMG 1005-99-132-3649 (Fig. 5), was also used with the L4 series of Brens and a special butt plate was sanctioned for use, with a large loop welded to the top. Finally there was a sling that actually spread the weight out rather than digging through the gunners' shoulder blades.








Fig. 5 GPMG sling and Modified Bren butt plate




I have seen contemporary photos that show a long Bren sling made simply from two rifle slings hooked together in a fireman’s grip; (Fig. 6) although I have not seen the relevant documentation, I have also been told it was officially sanctioned by a reliable source. It seems to be another stop gap method like the 3 piece sling in A.C.I. 337








Fig. 6 Firemen’s grip sling




The Australians introduced a 57 inch Slings, submachine gun, web in 1942 and no doubt they quickly started using them with their Brens as well. A similar length green sling was used with their L2A1, LMGs Sling, Small Arms, cotton web, 59-in long, Mk 11005-66-030-7857 (Fig. 8a) and would have been used with their L4A4s no doubt. Another sling, shown in their 1979 L4 Handbook, Sling, Carrying Ammunition 8465-66-040-0232 (Fig. 7) with two light weight looking hooks and double D ring adjustment of length was made. A third type of sling was used in the 1970s / 80s which resembled the UK L7 sling but with a sliding camouflaged shoulder pad. (Fig. 8b)









Kevin Adams collection



Fig. 7 Sling shown in Australian L4A4 handbook








Fig. 8 Australian L2A1and L4/M60 slings




A non swivelling hook is sometimes encountered, mainly on Canadian slings, and maybe that is why there was a change in nomenclature for the "normal" Bren hook, this type being the Mk. 2. (Fig. 4b) If anyone has further details, they would be appreciated.




Other Bren using countries used similar slings to the then current UK sling, such as Belgium. I am reliably informed that New Zealand, with it's L4s, dispensed with slings altogether.




The Bren tripods were only ever carried using a pair of standard rifle slings, or with nothing at all.




The sling on the UK Mk II Brens fitted at the front on the "smile" on the Mk II bipod. Unlike on the Mk I Bren you could completely dispense with the hooks on the Mk II, or Mk III when fitted with a Mk II bipod. Occasionally in contemporary photos Brens are seen being carried with the sling, minus the hook, looped around the barrel; or, especially during the Korean war, with the hooks attached to the front and rear mounting pins (no doubt damaging them in the process).




For most of WWII UK forces where not trained to fire from the hip except in emergencies and hence there was no long sling issued until the middle of 1944 and very few one piece 58 inch slings are seen being used, even in 1945. However from 1942 at the latest Indian Army LMG SATs where showing the gun being used from the hip with sling support, no doubt a result of experience in jungle warfare in Burma. (Fig. 9)








Fig. 9 Illustration from 1942 Indian LMG SAT Volume 1, Pamphlet No. 4 LMG Page 62




Trials ZB and ZGB guns were equipped with leather slings fitted with "Bren" hooks of Czech manufacture and can be clearly seen in contemporary photographs.







Fig. 10 ZB leather sling




Finally, just to show what could have been used on the Bren, Pre war Vickers Armstrong produced a excellent sling for their Vickers-Berthier light machine gun, which was adopted by the Indian Army, note the width.








Fig. 11 Vickers-Berthier LMG Slings




Tom Ready April 2008
Sources



Various LoCs, D.D.(E) s, Parts lists, photographs and manuals held at MoD SATIC (Pattern Room Library) and in my own collection

It would seam I cant edit the picture less version of this, could someone delete that one please?

[ActionYobbo]

Thank you for all this information
I have really learned alot
It is from great people like you tombear that new collectors like me can gain knoledge that would have been lost to history

[LesterH]

I have a couple of GPMG slings as well as the regular long webbing slings. Can confirm the GPMG sling is a more comfortable carry. As both of my Brens are D/A I cannot comment on the live fire topics.

[tombear]

Cheers! If you want some more overkill about obscure bits I have a couple more on cleaning rods and brushes and probably some other bits floating about the hard drive.

ATB

Tom

[LesterH]

Thank you, you are not alone. I have two bren boxes, the long cleaning rod,early multi tool, .303 and 7.62mm tool kits.Built up with the aid of http://www.lightmachinegun.org.uk

[tombear]

Cool, I hadn't realised Richard had put up my labelled red backed layouts. Glad they were of interest. I've also done a couple for two inch mortar rolls and the Besa 7.92 tool roll. I think I could do similar for the various UK M1919A4 kits.

ATB

Tom

[LesterH]

Tombear. Hope you don't mind. A militaria dealer friend of mine is using the photographs of the tool kits. To help collectors and re enactors build correct Bren tool kits. If your work is subject to copyright I can get these photographs withdrawn.

Kind regards, Lester