Potsdam musketoon/carbine?

[Patrick Chadwick]

Patrick is correct in identifying the Suhl contractor that made this Prussian M1809 musket or possibly a M1839 or M1839/55...

Thanks for the support, but as you can see, I have my doubts. The trouble is that there seem to have been shifting alliances between the various gunmaking houses according to the state of the market, i.e. who got which government contract, and whether or not he could cope or needed to call in assistance.

As to the model, it is similar to the Prussian M1839, but the lockplate looks more like that on a Bavarian M1848 Landwehr musket. This was a slightly chaotic period in longgun development, as the various states had a large number of muskets left over from the Napoleonic wars, which they were reluctant to throw away. And the Prussians had pressed everything into service that went bang. Which means that ex-Prussian "official" mixmasters were legion and not necessarily the product of Bubba and his colleagues. Plus everybody had captured everybody else's weapons and used them, often with adaptations. "100% original" is an expression to be applied with extreme caution in this period.

So there were original Napoleonic muskets, later muskets of hardly altered design, smooth-bore muskets with rifling cut later, musket-style guns made new with rifling, plus pillar-breech and Delvigne rifles both as new models and adaptations and upgrades of all of this floating around simultaneously. It was chaotic, and several gunmakers had difficulties coping with the demands made by army purchasers. Hence the more-or-less enforced cooperation out of desperation between various gunmakers and a resulting uncertainty as to who, exactly, made what, let alone when!

I wish I could have the whole thing in bits on my desk, study them, and then take the bits to the museum in Suhl and let them have a look! As it is, I can only go by the photos.

And please, Anzac15, I need that accurate bore measurement!

[gew8805]

Didn't think that it was a Prussian job, possibly a Confederate modificstion?

Sadly, almost certainly not, the modifications likely done long after the American Civil War.

Thanks for the new photos, especially the more distinct photos of the lockplate markings. As Patrick says, Paul Sauer & Sohn.

[gew8805]

I also need to add the following:

Keep in mind that the Confederate states did not purchase any firearms from Prussia, they didn't need them though they did aquire some by surrender or battlefield recovery and a few saw Confederate service in rear areas. Those actually issued to Federal forces were passed back into storage as quickly as possible by Federal regiments to whom they were issued when standard arms became available. They were the earliest purchased and imported Federal arms, initial importation came into US ports in November of 1861. Even though they were well made, durable arms, Federal inspectors rated them as 3rd and 4th class arms due to the large, nonstandard caliber.

[Anzac15]

That would have been my guess, captured or recovered, if in fact this was a Confederate arm.
Patrick, I will get that barrel measurement done as soon as I get home. Eager to see what it is.
You're definitely correct in saying be cautious about the word 'original'!