Primer 014: Ross Rifle Mark III (by C&Rsenal)

[Ax.303]

The most serious problems with the Ross mkiii(1910) are related to the small bolt stop which bore only against the segmented part of the bolt head. and the segmented bolt head itself, great swept lug area, but is it really necessary?
In addition, there is very limited support for the bolt body by the receiver.

Both of these issues were exasperated by improper heat treatment (soft) of the bolt heads followed by the emergency program to Re harden (cyanide quench) the existing bolt heads in the UK by dragoon ed troops, resulting in brittle bolts...

Close examination of most 1910 bolt lugs will show deformation or cracking on the left rear lug where it impacts the bolt stop.

I have 2 Ross 1910s, one which is smooth as snot, the other is "sticky" and the bolt has slight deformation, swapping bolts between the 2 guns moves the stickiness problem to the other gun.

You might want to check a few more than two bolts before you come to this conclusion.

Most bolts you will see are fine.

I`m not saying it does not happen. I have seen a few over the years, but most I`ve checked are in great shape and I have checked a pile of them including commercial M-10s and even a Home Guard which have the small bolt stop.
It is one of the first things I look for.

The problem they had 100 years ago was the bolt heads were soft because they had the wrong carbon content. The fix made them brittle.

I would think most of those are long gone.

Sometimes the bolt will be sticky because it is dirty or worn internally.

Information

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[flying pig]

The bolt stop problem is quite real, but in my mind's eye it could have been easily solved. Instead of having Evelyn spaced mega overkill number of lugs, he simply could have made the left rear two lugs into one much heavier lug while retaining the other lighter lugs. I'm no engineer, but it would have been less machining too.

[Ax.303]

The bolt stop problem is quite real, but in my mind's eye it could have been easily solved. Instead of having Evelyn spaced mega overkill number of lugs, he simply could have made the left rear two lugs into one much heavier lug while retaining the other lighter lugs. I'm no engineer, but it would have been less machining too.

I not saying the bolt will not deform with long hard use.

But it is far less common than some people make it out to be. Especially with the over sized bolt stop.

Making the back two left lugs as one would have worked well.

[Eaglelord17]

He could have also stuck with two lugs like how he did the Mk. IIs. Unfortunately by time they had fixed all the problems it was too late.

[flying pig]

I've been nursing a bolt head with a cracked lug for over a year now. I've been watching it closely for signs of further cracking. While it hasn't become worse, the damage is still there...

I have a box of bolt heads with broken lugs, like a half dozen of them.

[Ax.303]

I also have a rifle with a deformed cracked bolt head that I keep threatening to replace the head on. I dressed it up with a file, and it has been holding up for a couple years now.

I have three beat bolt heads in my junk box that were replaced sometime over last 100 years.

And then there are another eleven rifles in the safe with M-10 actions and a couple spare bolts with bolt heads that are in great shape.

Replace your bolt head. You`ll be good for another 100 years or so.

[Sentryduty]

I have a box of bolt heads with broken lugs, like a half dozen of them.

Could you share some up close photos of the cracking and breakage? It would be helpful to see what these things do when they begin to go.

[Surpmil]

Could it be done?
I would like to be involved in a project like that in any way I could. I do not have much knowledge to contribute on the topic but could surely manage what ever was assigned to me.

I am quite serious if someone wants to take the lead.

Any rewrite would require the cooperation of the gentleman who now owns the rights to the original manuscript and has recently republished it. Kudos to him for doing so as original copies were in short supply.

[flying pig]

I'll try to remember to in the coming weeks

[M94/14]

Most of the original rifles I've seen with the early bolt stop were the Home Guard rifles. When the Bolt stop was updated, so was the front band (Forged instead of stamped) and the stock was thicker from the mid band forward. Mine has the larger Bolt stop, and there are no issues with deformation. It also cycles and extracts perfectly, although the cases do suffer the usual enlargement just forward of the solid head portion of the case from the enlarged chamber.


Ross' could have made the last two lugs on the left side solid, but it would have been even more of a nightmare to machine. The lugs in the receiver, and the bolt for that matter, are basically a form of coarse threads. Hence the "interrupted screw" designation when describing the locking lugs.

BTW, the Lee Enfield Rifles also had problems with the crappy British Contract ammo, and rifles had to be sent to the rear areas to get the chambers enlarged. Funny how THEY didn't receive the same bad press as the Ross'