Lee Enfields and Boat Tailed Bullets

[Peter Laidler]

In Oz.......... Was he a former pom? I never knew that! I hope that you're enjoying the Easter break one and all

[vintage hunter]

Aside from throat and muzzle condition there's another thing that i believe affects how well a given rifle handles BT bullets,or any bullet really, is the shape of the bullet itself. Particularly the radius of the ogive and to a lesser degree the length and taper of the boat tail. How a bullet enters the bore has a much creater effect on accuracy than how it leaves it. I don't see where muzzle wear has that much effect on accuracy. I have a no.4 T with a very worn muzzle, including a groove from a cleaning rod that makes the muzzle oval shaped, that consistently produces 3 shot groups at 100 yds averaging 1'' with no fliers. I also have a factory built Win. M70 HB in .243 that has rode muzzle down in a truck so long that the muzzle is worn off at an angle. It shoots M.O.A. out to 600 yds with Sierra 100gr BT Gamekings. It won't shoot FB bullets anywhere near that well. Then theres the sporterized M24 Yugo in 8x57 with barely visible rifling that shoots sub M.O.A. at 100yds w/ 225gr Sierra BT Gamekings. Any thoughts on these anyone?

[Son]

Everything about the bullet's path from ignition to exiting the barrel will effect it's accuracy. Sure, quite a lot of things like throat erosion, wear, rust, pitting, cord wear and crown could be conditions that are not ideal in the search for small groups. The main thing to remember is that accuracy is achieved by having the rifle and projectile react to every shot exactly the same. We can control a lot of the other variables with the precision of the loads, ensuring the barrel has reacted the same every time. If all other influencing factors are doing the exact same thing from shot to shot, then accuracy is achievable. I would suggest any variations in loads (shot to shot) would probably print a bigger group in barrels like you describe above than in one of good condition.
Sometimes you can just get lucky. One of my No1 rifles goes from MOA to 4moa with half a turn on the rear nosecap screw.

I hope this has made sense...

---------- Post added at 09:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:31 AM ----------

In Oz.......... Was he a former pom? I never knew that! I hope that you're enjoying the Easter break one and all

I recall someone saying he came over in the second fleet....
Not sure, mate. I think so..

[enfield303t]

Thanks to all, very interesting and lots to digest. Seeing as I have 500 Sierra BT 174 gr I sure hope my No4 likes them. I will be very diligent on reloading specs. If they shoot well I will report back, if not will sit in a corner and cry.

[Son]

Thanks to all, very interesting and lots to digest. Seeing as I have 500 Sierra BT 174 gr I sure hope my No4 likes them. I will be very diligent on reloading specs. If they shoot well I will report back, if not will sit in a corner and cry.

Good Luck!
Post your results no matter what- there may be other things to try...

[tbonesmith]

Thanks to all, very interesting and lots to digest. Seeing as I have 500 Sierra BT 174 gr I sure hope my No4 likes them. I will be very diligent on reloading specs. If they shoot well I will report back, if not will sit in a corner and cry.

All this stuff is good and interesting, but in the absence of steady supply of Mk VII or much other military surplus .303 ammo, most people like me and you are forced to handload, and depending on your range and club rules may be forced into using FMJ's or equivalent match ammo (
ie. sierra matchkings) most/all??? of which is boat tailed. You needn't be too bothered about it because if your barrel is good, and your bedding is good, then they will shoot very well.
BTW has anyone else tried the .312 hornady matchkings? I gave them a run in a No4Mk2 that had just started shooting the .3105 hornady FMJ's like an absolute pig (it had previously loved them), and it was good as gold! Heaps of throat wear and all!

[enfield303t]

Today I am going to load the Match Kings with 36gr. of CR17 and a overall length of 3.045". I could have them a little longer but the milspec ammo I have are that length so it will be a good place to start.

The Lee Enfield is a Savage No4 that is a double and I always wanted a scoped rifle so used a S&K mount which I will have to shim as it is shooting high. The scope is a older Leupold 6X that my son donated from his M14. It actually looks pretty good on the rifle. They eyes just aren't what they used to be so the scope is the answer.

I have two complete No4 T's but consider them too sacred to shoot.

Took it out yesterday and used some 150 grain SP reloads I did a couple of years ago. They were loaded with 39gr of 3031 with a OAL of 2.905 for a different No4 that is a pretty decent shooter. Now the unbelievable thing is at 300 yards it shot groups of 1.5" and 2". My son and I just stared at each other when we went to check the target, hard to believe and we only hope it will do that with the Sierra's.

I bought the gun from bearhunter and when talking to him last night told me the gentleman he bought it from said it was a good shooter, that might be a understatement if this type of accuracy continues.

Probably won't get out to try the new loads for a couple of weeks as the Kamloops Gun Show is next week and it is a must attend.

[David TS]

Good deal David. I'll bet that rifle visited me last year before heading back to the UK! There's some more on the way too so you guys over there save up some Quid and get one when they're available. Enjoy 'em while you can.

Brian
As you deduced, it did indeed pass through your hands

I said at the time that I didn't think there were any markings on it from when it arrived stateside, I was wrong. In very small engraved letters at the rear right of the receiver is E W Mil, Fraser Mi (which I believe is East West Military Inc)

[Brian Dick]

East West Military in Michigan was the importer to the USA. I think he's out of the import business now but still maintains a shop. He always had nice stuff.

[gsimmons]

He closed his shop a number of years ago. I don't see him at the MAAC shows anymore. Too bad he's a nice guy.