Win Garand Receiver Weld Question w/pics

[Bob Seijas]

Griff is right, they were all not worn out, it was the intention of the anti-gunners to destroy
M1s rather than sell them. It was only stopped by a concerted political effort on the part of a few heroic collectors and the NRA.

The "Reweld" (the collector term used for 50 years, Rick, LOL) was invented by Bob Penny and copied by many others after Bob made so much money doing it. Those first ones were really good and hard to spot -- I got hooked with one, too.

Although I have never heard of one that failed and injured a shooter, I question the cumulative effect of firing one over a long period of time. I would not personally shoot a welded gun, as they are all quite old by now.

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[Rick Cummelin]

Although I have never heard of one that failed and injured a shooter, I question the cumulative effect of firing one over a long period of time. I would not personally shoot a welded gun, as they are all quite old by now.

While I have also never heard of a failure where a shooter was injured, I agree that I would NEVER knowingly shoot a welded receiver again. Pages 79-84 of Jerry Kuhnhausen's most excellent "The U.S. .30 Caliber Service Rifles" are several photos of welded receivers that have failed by cracking at the weld(s). Jerry also feels that the silver-soldered barrels are much more dangerous to a shooter than the welded receiver. Plus, as Bob mentioned, heat-treated steel that has been welded does not get better with age--it's not a fine wine. In fact, a friend of mine who is a precision welder for Ball Aerospace (works on satellites and other space junk) has told me on several occasions that he believes welded receivers on any semi-auto rifle, that haven't been re-heat-treated, are equivalent to a grenade with the pin pulled, except we don't know how long the fuse is. Possibly a good analogy.

IMHO, shooting a welded receiver, especially with one of the silver-soldered barrels is engaging in some sort of weird Russian Roulette. Granted, you may never have a problem, but then again, it could fail tomorrow. Remember the movie "The Deer Hunter"?

Anyway, I'm still hoping we can somehow convince zrunr that he needs to find something better than a welded receiver if he wants a good shooter. Or, maybe not......

[xroads]

i replaced the receiver, bbl and trigger housing with good, used, gi parts from my parts bins (stuff left over when i disassembled complete rifles for parts i needed for restorations). cost wasn't an issue for the owner, he wanted something that he could shoot without safety issues. i cleaned up the trigger for him and properly lubed and sighted it in too. he could have had a really nice service grade CMP rifle and a couple of cans of lake city ammo for what he had into it when all was said and done. i kept the "interesting parts" for show-and-tell.

[kar66]

You notice I didn't say welded receiver. Thats because mine has both weled receiver and barrel. I'm not sure when I got it. But I still remember the day. It was probably early 80s. I know it was before they started reimporting them. It was at the old Bagnell Dam Show, man what a great show that use to be. Anyway I shot it a lot and with mostly with soft point hunting ammo. Back then we didn't hunting ammo wasn't safe in M1s. No internet to keep us safe. Never had any problems with it. Later after you could get good barrels and receivers. I stripped it down and used the parts to build a good one. I still have the barreled reciever in my shop. It would pobably be OK, but I don't want to shoot it anymore. I don't need to anymore, I can get better M1s NOW. That were almost impossible to buy or afford before the 1985 law change. Bll

[Dr342]

Never heard of one blowing up. But op-rod track alignment can be an issue. Ive know of at least 2 chronic op-rod issues (jumping track) that after swapping several rods was determined to be a reweld. Too many nice ones out there for me, but each to thier own.

[Mark in Rochester]

The key thing to check on a welded receiver is the firing pin protrusion. It is critical that the safety bridge with the firing pin retraction cam be properly located. If this critical dimension is not correct the possibility of an out of battery slam fire is increased.

as far as durability it would seem that the load is carried by the front of the receiver and would not be impacted by the weld

For me it is a risk without a reward - buy a CMP rifle and be safe

[zrunr]

I appreciate all the comments and background. There is no halo on this receiver so perhaps the heat treatment was done correctly. I don't see any markings on the barrel. This particular Garand is missing the 4 internal parts for some reason. What would a Garand in this condition be worth? The stock, op arm, trigger group, sights, gas block, bolt, firing pin etc. are all SA and are in very good condition. The barreled action could at least be used for a drill rifle or wall hanger.

What is the best course of action to take with this type of Garand? My goal is just to have a decent shooting Garand.

I also came across a Tanker Garand with a welded receiver done not quite as nicely as this full-size but otherwise in good condition. What would that be worth?

[Rick Cummelin]

I appreciate all the comments and background. There is no halo on this receiver so perhaps the heat treatment was done correctly. I don't see any markings on the barrel. This particular Garand is missing the 4 internal parts for some reason. What would a Garand in this condition be worth? The stock, op arm, trigger group, sights, gas block, bolt, firing pin etc. are all SA and are in very good condition. The barreled action could at least be used for a drill rifle or wall hanger.

What is the best course of action to take with this type of Garand? My goal is just to have a decent shooting Garand.

I also came across a Tanker Garand with a welded receiver done not quite as nicely as this full-size but otherwise in good condition. What would that be worth?

Your best course of action? Simple. RUN AWAY!!

What is ANY welded receiver worth? Absolutely NOTHING, but that's the wrong question. You need to ask: "What is my eyesight worth?" If you are unlucky & buy one that fails, what is it worth to you to be blind the rest of your life? As far as the internal parts are concerned, go back & re-read my earlier post. Unless they have been replaced over the years (due to problems), the parts also came from the scrap pile. Sure, they're refinished so they look OK, but their worth is minimal--maybe $50 for all the junk.

My recommendation--Stop looking at junk and buy a decent Service Grade M1 from the CMP.

[Calif-Steve]

FedOrd in Southern Calif. sold many Tanker Garands, all welded rifles. I used to do the Great Western Show and saw many Tankers that would not run. Sold those guys lots of parts. No danger of them blowing up at all, but they seldom run right. To me, a Tanker is a pricey parts kit.

[Griff Murphey]

It has been suggested that all of the M-1s scrapped were destroyed because they were worn out/unsafe etc. One day I was in Morgan's Gun shop on Jacksboro Highway in Fort Worth. This would have been about 1966. Four match M-1s (May have been NM rifles, or match conditioned regular rifles)were brought in, scrapped. All had been in immaculate condition. The bolts were locked to the rear, and each rifle was torch-cut across the receiver, the stocks sawed off at the pistol grips, then sold along with the other scrap from Carswell AFB.

So, logic does not always play into the whys and wherefores of the military.

I cannot vouch for their final disposition, but the "gunsmith" at Morgan's cut the weld off of the least-torched one, and fired it several times as a straight pull, unrestored, which I thought was interesting.