My recent trip through the States

[talucah]

Can you tell me why anyone would put a plant in Michigan? Michigan is bankrupt, Detroit is bankrupt, but they refuse to consider reducing spending and keep raising taxes, making the situation worse. Last time we visited my in-laws I remember driving downtown and passing many many reinforced concrete skeletons, that once were active manufacturing plants. What hurts is that the country is following the Michigan model, with I fear the same results.
Bob

[0311Shooter]

Oh boy, the setting changes but old 2571 still spews his wharped posts. Blame the ills of the country on Bush, Mr. Olberman and Mr. Matthews.

How soon we forget???? As I recollect, the economy was doing pretty good, unemployment was under 5%, and gasoline was about $1.75 a gallon back in January 2007. That was just when democrats took over the house and senate, and it went totally, totally, totally downhill from then on.

Hey, my memory is still good. I CAN remember two years back. Really, I can.

[2571]

I don't know if there's hope for the rust belt.

There is an infrastructure here which would be useful for manufacturing transportation needs; there is a skilled workforce here familiar with heavy manufacture; and, we're trying to adapt our taxation to accomodate heavy industry.

Nobody's coming here for the weather, that's for sure.
________

There's an anthropological principle that current humor comments on societal status:

Four old retired guys are walking down a street in Sebastian, Florida. They turned a corner and see a sign that says, 'Old Timers Bar - all drinks 10 cents.' They look at each other, and then go in, thinking this is too good to be true.

The old bartender says in a voice that carries across the room, 'Come on in and let me pour one for you! What'll it be, Gentlemen?'

There seemed to be a fully-stocked bar, so each of the men ask for a martini. In short order, the bartender serves up four iced martinis... Shaken, not stirred, and says, 'That'll be 10 cents each, please'

The four men stare at the bartender for a moment.

Then look at each other. They can't believe their good luck. They pay the 40 cents, finish their martinis, and order another round.

Again, four excellent martinis are produced with the bartender again saying, 'That's 40 cents, please.'

They pay the 40 cents, but their curiosity is more than they can stand. They have each had two martinis and so far they've spent less than a dollar.

Finally one of the men says, 'How can you afford to serve martinis as good as these for a dime a piece?'

'I'm a retired tailor from Boston,' the bartender said, and I always wanted to own a bar. Last year I hit the Lottery for $25 million and decided to open this place. Every drink costs a dime - wine, liquor, beer, it's all the same.'

Wow!!!! That's quite a story,' says one of the men.

The four of them sipped at their martinis and couldn't help but notice seven other people at the end of the bar who didn't have drinks in front of them, and hadn't ordered anything the whole time they were there.
One man gestures at the seven at the end of the bar without drinks and asks the bartender,

'What's with them?'

The bartender says, 'Oh, they're all old retired far ts from Michigan. They're waiting for happy hour when drinks are half price

[Rick Gushman]

2571, Let's get the facts straight. This roots of this economic disaster began well before Bush took office. It had to do with liberal polices regarding home mortgage financing which took place during the Clinton administration. Specifically, the federal government put pressure on lending institutions to reduce their conventional requirements for a home loan because these policies were deemed on the basis of statistical analysis to "disadvantage" minorities. I've heard that there are three kinds of liars - "white" liars, damned liars and statisticians. The democrats also rejected in committee proposed legislation to increase the oversight for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac because it was felt that they were not using good judgment regarding high risk loans. I remember Barney Frank specifically stating that such ovesight was not required since the leadership of these entities were doing such a good job. A good job they were doing alright, they were laying the foundation for the near collapse of the lending market nationwide. I'm not saying that the management of some lending institutions weren't also to blame but it is very clear what actions and by whom fueled this disaster. Also regarding heavy industry in the so called "rust belt", for years this area was responsible for creating more wealth than anything seen before or since. I firmly believe that the wealth of a nation is directly proportional to its ability to create goods. However, many liberal politicians began killing the golden goose many years ago. They used such things as environmental restrictions, health and safety requirements, corporate fuel economy standards and high corporate taxes to do the dirlty deed. None of these things are inherently bad but carried to an extreme they have a devastating long term effect on the viability of heavy industry - particularly the automotive industry. To make things all the worse, the government has yet to address the health care issue. Virtually all large manufacturing concerns provide health care for their workers and their families. Their foriegn competition don't have to deal with this added cost since health care is government supplied or underwritten. This puts nearly all American based companies at a distinct financial disadvantage relative to their foreign competitors. There has been a lot of talk about US companies not handling union contracts properly when times began to get tough. It's easy to say that the companies should have reduced wages and particularly benefits when time changed but how can they do that when they will be faced with a crippling strike if they push too hard? It's an easy thing to say but it's a far more difficult thing to accomplish. I've heard too much about mismanagement of US manufacturing companies and while there certainly is some, the real problem is with the US government and most to the problem was the direct result of policies pushed by liberal politicians. Rick

[Former Cav]

I'm retired and my 401K's have LOST about 65% of their values. Meanwhile, Barrack Hussein and CONGRESS (the opposite of PROGRESS!) continue to give away BILLIONS to their buddies.
I don't believe that I will live long enough for my 401's to recover.
I wish you all good luck
Cav

[JohnMOhio]

Mr. Gushman, you have explained it precisely in no uncertain terms. I also blame some of these financial companies that came up with the creative financing they put out there. The initial low payment loans for 5 years for example and then starting in the 6th year or so the payments would increase. They were also selling it on the idea that the home would continue to increase in value and should they not be able to afford the monthly increase in payments, they could then sell the home for a profit or refinance.

The other thing I see is the "loan you deserve" so you can finance that boat, car, a vacation or what ever. This came about after deleting the federal tax deductions on interest you paid on loans for autos, boats and even credit cards. Home equity loans were sold that way. They used to be called 2nd Mortgages not the fancy "home equity loan." I saw it all to often on cars. They get a home equity loan for 15 years to purchase a car that lasts only 10 years at most. Or the boat that is tied up to the dock because they can't put in 50 gallons of gas for the weekend. Meanwhile they have put their home at risk.

Worst part of it is that the Public Bought that sales pitch. Get what you deserve now. Put you equity to work for you. They didn't think moving equity from a somewhat "solid" investment as a home that was increasing in value to an auto or boat that would be decreasing in value. Smart Move.

I guess I have said enough and I am pretty much angry about the whole mess this country has found itself in due to Greed and the I want it now attitude because I deserve it. Hogwash.