Indian L1A1 Scabbards

[Flying10uk]

Here is another long Indian L1A1 bayonet which I've recently purchased. Normally I wouldn't purchase such a bayonet in this damaged state but did on this occasion. This is because it came with the rare long steel scabbard, the blade is in excellent condition and the price was very good too.

Does anyone know where I could get a replacement catch assembly from, please? I will most likely remove the muzzle ring and weld on the missing metal rather than total replacement.

[Peter Laidler]

To be truly honest, with the palava that you're going to go through removing the old X-piece you might just as well prepare yourself for an hours work on the bench, and make a new one. The pommel has got to come off by way of 2x hidden rivets that you're going to have to remake, as has the old X-piece by way of 2x rivets which you're also going to have to remake.

As for parts, you could just look for a cheapo damaged L1A1 bayonet/blade, take the X-piece and catch assembly and scrap the rest. Done it a few times where I have made up 2 or 3 out of 5 or so scrap ones. A X-piece is simplicity itself to make by hand

[browningautorifle]

I should think welding would be far harder, and making the muzzle ring as well would be just short of making a crosspiece.

[Flying10uk]

The idea of repairing the old cross guard was to try and preserve as much of the original bayonet as possible but it may be simpler to replace completely. I'll remove the catch from the other example I have in order to see what they look like/how they were made. Would the catch have been hardened/case hardened steel originally? Thanks for the info

[Peter Laidler]

Preserving a crosspiece....... THAT crosspiece..... Come on F-10! The catch is mild steel as is the screw and plunger.

[browningautorifle]

I'd think the welding would cause issues by it's self too. I'm sure canalizing a sacrificial common bayonet would leave it in just as original shape as it is now. Peter and his crew would have done in a nunce...and verified it to stores. That would be a proper repair, thus original as issue.

[Flying10uk]

Peter did you see many muzzle rings break off L1A1 bayonets? I'm not exactly sure what has happened to this example but the story that came with it was that it had been "converted" into a fighting knife. As previously mentioned I purchased it because of the very good condition blade, it came with a scabbard and the price. I'm not planning to start work on this immediately but will consider the options first. All versions of the SLR bayonet seem to advertised for a fair amount of money now but I guess that there isn't that many of them available anymore.

I will report back on how I decide to repair or replace the cross guard but however I end up doing it the end result will be a professional job.

[tankhunter]

The waisted Crossguard L1A3 & the earlier converted L1A1 Bayonets to A3 Spec. Were subject to fractured muzzle rings on a VERY common occurance in Service. It was the thinnest area of the 'waiting' that was the weak point. THAT was where they Broke, EVERY time! Hence the introduction of the Straight Crossguard, of the much improved L1A4 Variants. This strengthend the weak area, & was much better suited to Bayonet 'Work!.....

When writing bayonets off, as was common as an Armourer. During Inspection Periods. We used to canablise all the useful parts from them. Like grip scales, retention catches, plungers, springs & retaining screws. These were checked for serviceability, & if ok. Put on the shelves, in the 'Bayonet Spares' boxes.
Then the main bayonets were 'destroyed' & reduced to 'Salvage'. By either Putting the blades in a vice, & snapping them in Half with the aid of some steel tubing. To provide extra hard levering force. Or cut in half with the 'Gas Axe' or Oxy-Acetelyne Torch.

If I remember correctly, if the blade got down to/ was reduced to 7.5" Inches in 'Effective' Length. That was the standard for writing off, what 'Appeared' to be a perfectly good bayonet!
We used to put these in a secret stash box. & when we got twenty at a time, used to send them to Field Workshops for Chrome plating. Then we would make a nice wooden Shield, & fit a capbadge of the unit we were attached to at that time. & make a brass plaque, that also was sent to workshops for engraving. Of the details of a SNCO that was leaving the unit, as a gift from all the Senior ranks in the Mess. This was in addition to whatever else the mess chose to present the recipient with as well.

[Peter Laidler]

I'm sure the other Armourers will agree that the broken X-piece was usually due to it being bent in the first place. Usually during horseplay as I can't think of a another way for it to be bent. I don't think that you'd bend it by a bit of rough bayonet fighting, shooting or sitting across/on it. Then they try to straighten it square using their handy Leatherman as it won't go back on the rifle and the arms storeman won't accept it back into the Armoury. That's when it snaps! We could straighten them but only if using heat and then all was well. The write-off value was so little that it didn't make economic sense to waste too much time on them. Well, not unless it was for yourself of course as Tankie alludes to above.

Same as SA80 bayonets. Spare catches and springs were always dues-out. Difficult to mount on anything too because a), they were too tough and hard to drill and tap (but just possible if tapped VERY carefully) and b), being round handled, hard to hold in order to machine a flat surface to drill into and mount it to anything.

But back to thread 31 again. I suppose everyone has noted that the Indian long bayonet uses No5 type wood grips. Not exactly the same I hasten to add because the hole centres aren't quite matched. Although they were probably designed to match up! They might have been using metric inch measurements instead of imperial inches. I blame the EU! That means no use trying to put L1A1 grips onto an Indian long one.

[Flying10uk]

I did read that soldiers have another (unauthorised) use for bayonets the world over and that is as a hammer/multi purpose hitting device.