Inherited old uniform regalia - need help!

[Gil Boyd]

Pantographing applied to WW1/WW2 medals to, but not the Stars as mentioned earlier. I do know of several old soldiers who definately did the time, but had no pantographing carried out on their medals, so again, it appears to be hit and miss affair, but most have their details enscribed. I noticed when I applied for medals not given at the time, for a few of my locals, they came back with no pantographing at all FYI.

[Gil Boyd]

Here are some examples of a group containing both pre and post WW2 medals which are currently for sale on that site. Notice nothing on the stars at all. Incidently the Military Cross does get stamped with the year it was won nothing else FYI

[Peter Laidler]

Yep, definately hand stamped as opposed to engraved. With the old 7 figure regimental number (shown by Gil in thread 42) as opposed to the later, post 1949(?) ARMY 8 figure number that I seem to recall started at 20 000 000. Mine started 23xxxxxx allocated in 1963. Officer and Womens numbers were all 6 figures and from 2010 this changed and Officer and NCO's numbers were the same, starting at 30 000 000

[Flying10uk]

It is these 2 medals which I'm referring to, specifically, the 1939-45 war medal and the 1939-45 Defence medal. I have not seen an example of either that has been marked on the rim with the soldiers details which leads me to suspect that they were issued unmarked. If anyone has an example of either medal medal that has been marked on the rim and it is believed that this was done at the time of issue I would be interested to see an image of it, please.

[Gil Boyd]

As I said earlier in this thread. The pantographing of all medals was never the case, it was very hit and miss.

I can however say that the War Medal 1939-45 was struck in cupro-nickel and issued "unnamed", however, those issued to Australian and South African personnel were officially named. The Canadian version of this medal was struck in silver.
You would have had to have performed 28 days between 3rd September 1939 and 2nd September 1945 to be eligible for this medal.

In relation to the Defence Medal 1939-45 (Green and Orange) it was struck again in cupro-nickel and it was generally "unnamed", the Canadian medal was struck in silver. Issued to service personnel for 3 years service at home, one yeras service in a non operational area eg. India or six months service overseas in territories subjected to air attack or otherwise closely threatened.
Hope that answers the query, but I am sure there will be those out there who have had their own medals enscribed by other services on both these medals, not by the MOD.

[Gil Boyd]

This link may also be helpful for a few conundrums surrounding British Medal issue note it is a General Guide

Naming Styles on British War Medals General Guide

[Flying10uk]

Ok thanks Gil for the information which confirms what I suspected about the U.K. issue of these 2 medals, i.e. they were issued in the U.K. unnamed. My Grandfather was entitled to both medals but didn't claim them on the grounds of "if all his country could give him for risking his life for several years were 2 cheap bits of metal, they were not worth bothering with" and so he never claimed them. My Grandfather was entitled to them because of his service in the Home Guard and according to The Imperial War Museum very unusually also served in the Civil Defence as an Air Raid Warden during the same period.

Air Raid Wardens put themselves in "harms way" and in danger because they were out and about during air-raids trying to give help and assistance to people where it was needed. I know one incident that my Grandfather helped out at involved a farm that had been hit early evening with incendiaries, which was on fire, and there was an urgent need to get the fires out before the main bomber force arrived and started bombing using the fires as markers/aiming points. There was a problem with getting access to the farm with a fire appliance but my Grandfather did help "manhandle" a portable fire pump to the farm, with some difficulty. The only source of water for the pump was a well which very quickly dried up at which point the main bomber force arrived and started bombing on the fires. There was nothing more that could be done and the fire fighters together with my grandfather decided to call it a day. The Fire Fighters of WW2 often seem to get forgotten about, risking their lives on a nightly basis, on the Home Front.

[Gil Boyd]

You can, as an immediate relative claim for his medals, which I suggest you do, even if it is only for future generations to marvel at.

[Peter Laidler]

The problem is that if the County Civil Defence or NFS/AFS fire authority didn't put the member forward or the paperwork is missing they simply will not issue the medal. I don't know whether that applies to civilians but it certainly applies to the Army.

[Flying10uk]

My Grandfather qualified for the medals twice because he was a member of the Civil Defence, a civilian organisation, and also the Home Guard, a military organisation. The Imperial War Museum said, in the 1970s, that this was very unusual to be in both organisations at the same time because if the Germans had invaded he ran the risk of being shot as a spy by belonging to both at the same time. It has been suggested that the Germans would have treated the Civil Defence as civilians but captured Home Guard as prisoners of war had they invaded.