Headspace gauge for 308 vs Nato

[SDoldiron]

Are the headspace gauges for 308 win accurate to use in a Ishy 2A or other 7.62 X 51 ? What brand of guages would you recommend?
Thanks

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[tbonesmith]

They are the same. I've got a set of Forster headspace gauges from Brownells. 308 Win no Go Gauge

[Terry N.]

Actually, they are different; Forster makes gauges to NATO specs. World's Largest Supplier of Firearm Accessories, Gun Parts and Gunsmithing Tools - BROWNELLS

[TARGSHOOT]

Just a note here, if you would like to know the skinney on this long argued subjet, and still is...
Pick up a copy of Jerry Khunhausens .30 cal. service rifle manual. it covers this particular subject in depth in the M14 section. well worth the cost only about 35.00 bucks covers the m-1 and m14 rifles with drawings etc.. nato minimuim is 1.634 Commercial .308 saami is 1.630 respectively. would also note that .223 commercial and .556 mil spec has about the same diff but on a different scale

[Patrick Chadwick]

quote=SDoldiron;156022]Headspace gauge for 308 vs Nato Are the headspace gauges for 308 win accurate to use in a Ishy 2A or other 7.62 X 51 ? What brand of guages would you recommend? Thanks[/quote]

Actually, they are different; Forster makes gauges to NATO specs. World's Largest Supplier of Firearm Accessories, Gun Parts and Gunsmithing Tools - BROWNELLS

So they are the same but different?

Who cares?

None of my rifles has ever seen a headspace gauge while in my care.* And probably never will. I don't fire headspace gauges. I fire cartridges that are neck-sized only - and only fired in the same rifle in which they were first fired. That means that the Schultz & Larsen does not use the same cases as the Carl Gustaf, the Enfield No4 Mk 2 does not use the same cases as the Enfield No 1 MkV, the Boer Mauser does not use the same cases as the Brazilian, and the Mauser M1871 (as featured in the Argentine RB saga) does not not use the same cases as the M1871 Jaeger.

A friend had what looked like a super-bargain Springfield 1903-A3. Head clearance was about 1/20" (I think Bubba managed to rebarrel it with the barrel 1/2 turn out of register). Ignition was OK - the cases were being held back by the extractor! Shoulders had moved forwards about 1mm / 40 thou). The ominous bright line above the base was there all right, but no cases separated. And in this instance, you didn't need a headspace gauge to see that something was grieviously wrong.

Hoping this will provoke some discussion (the forums are rather quiet at the moment), I remain your humble servant and non-headspace-gauge-using practical shooter...


...Patrick


*P.S: In order not to give an incorrect impression, I do not fire new rifles without checking them, but I use the method described in the Argentine RB series for checking the head clearance with a threaded rod and an empty case. A meter length of 6mm diameter/1mm pitch rod and a couple of nuts saves a drawerful of expensive used-once-only headspace gauges.

[Pattern14]

I agree whole heartedly!!! If you reload just neck size and segregate the brass for each rifle and you'll not have any problems.

[jmoore]

Regarding gages for an Ishapore 7.62, I don't that it's been established WHAT standard they used. Note that the British gages for the L42a1 et al. are different (different datums AND tolerances!)than the US spec. Also, there's the M14 spec., M14 Match, etc., etc. There's even a newer chambering spec that sort of combines 308W and 7.62x51 along the .223 Wylde concept. "Black Hole Weaponry" is the originator.

Patrick Chadwick's right. You can make about any chambering work IF you reload. Otherwise, in this case, just make sure that you won't suffer case head separations by whatever means you can contrive and drive on. No need to blow good money on gages unless you are going to do your own chambering.

[Patrick Chadwick]

For those who fret about a couple of thou excess headspace, take a look at this:

https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=29623

Must be something of a headspace record. And I am going to get a 200-pack of those PRVI cases- they are obviously TOUGH

[jmoore]

How about 7.62x51 fired in 30-06 chambers? Seen that one more than once. No sign of head separation, but no neck at all, just a nice "crimp". Probably have one or two rattling around somewhere, but it may be a day or a year before I find any to photo!

[vintage hunter]

Patrick, The case bulges are normal in Arisaka's. It has nothing to do with headspace. Both of my T38 carbines have good headspace and the fired cases look the same as the pics. I've had Norma 6.5 cases that lasted for close to 25 loadings and finally tossed them due to split necks. I sectioned a few and they showed no signs of head seperation. PRVI cases are good, I use them in my T38 carbines and a no.4T that just closes on a .074 gage. Got 12 loadings on some of the .303's with no seperations yet.