Lee Enfield No.4 Mk 1 (T)

[Salt Flat]

Hello All, I have been looking at this Savage No. 4 Mk 1 (T) on the Oldguns.net website. I really don't know much about these but am learning. I probably can't buy it right now but thought it would be good to hear what the forum members think about it anyway. It seems like a pretty good deal and a starting point if original. I looked at the sample one in the Knowledge Library and it seems to match up and is in the correct serial range. Still the expensive part is missing--scope and mount. What do you think?

Collectible Foreign Longarms Catalog (2nd item)

Salt Flat

Information

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[Roger Payne]

Looks as honest as the day is long. Too tatty to be a fake! (But deserving of some tender loving care). Still appears to have its original bolt, & also has a readily visible scope number. Many Savage Mk1* (T)'s ended up as 'less telescope' rifles, but not all. A few T's also slipped through with 2 groove barrels on them, so the barrel might not necessarily be a replacement.

ATB.

[snipershot1944]

I've done business with John Spangler the site owner from time to time over the years. Great guy, a real gentleman.

David

[RobD]

That's a very good price!

[Badger]

Check the MKL and read this article by Advisory Panel member Lance:

1942 No.4 Mk1*(T) Savage Sniper Rifle (less scope)

Regards,
Doug

[Surpmil]

Rifle 14C5906, scope No. on wrist 1431.

Just for posterity.

Mag looks like it's going to fall out. A bit like this one!

Attachment 50949

Scope No.1423 was on a 1941 Maltby I used to own IIRC.

Bit of a tangent I know, but what if anything can we learn from the scope numbers seen on these early non-Trials conversions? Specifically, if we see higher numbers from the same scope maker originally fitted to ex-Trials No4(T)s, do we have evidence that some of these early non-Trials rifles were converted at RSAF(E) in the same 'run' as the ex-Trials rifles?

[Roger Payne]

Good point Rob, though it's complicated by the fact that there were several manufacturers & scope number 3050 (for example) an early HBM Co would probably have been manufactured considerably before scope number 2050 (William Watson), as the serial number ranges were split between contractors from the outset. Having said that, it's still doable with a sound knowledge of scope serials.

Speaking off the top of my head 1431 would be a 1941 Watson?

[RobD]

That's a very good price! $795 = £478. I am surprised nobody has bought it yet. If I lived in the USA, and if I hadn't just bought a No 4(T) from Brian Dick (which I have - lucky me), I would snap it up. I would then buy a repro bracket and fit a vintage Weaver scope which looks a bit like a No 32 scope until I laid hands on an original scope and bracket.

[Surpmil]

Good point Rob, though it's complicated by the fact that there were several manufacturers & scope number 3050 (for example) an early HBM Co would probably have been manufactured considerably before scope number 2050 (William Watson), as the serial number ranges were split between contractors from the outset. Having said that, it's still doable with a sound knowledge of scope serials.

Speaking off the top of my head 1431 would be a 1941 Watson?

Yes, that would fit with Peter's research IRRC Roger.

Quite agree re number allocations and concurrent production by the different makers using their allocated serial ranges. I suppose we don't know when contracts or deliveries actually began for any of them(?)

[MJ1]

I have two Savage rifles and both are extremely accurate at any range but get very inspiring past 600 yards. Maybe I should say consistent out there. With out digging them out one is a 12C and the other a 15C both were virtually new with the 12C having alight coat of cosmoline in and out on every surface while the 15C had been cleaned and fired. I would never be shy about showing up at a vintage match with these rifles. My thanks to Roger Payne and Pete Bloom for their help in scoping up these rifles.