+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 21

Thread: Does anyone know if sniper rifles were issued to 2nd AIF for service in Middle east

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #1
    FREE MEMBER
    NO Posting or PM's Allowed
    gwahlert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last On
    04-19-2014 @ 04:08 AM
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    18
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    09:18 AM

    Does anyone know if sniper rifles were issued to 2nd AIF for service in Middle east

    Hi Guys,

    In writing a book on Aust Army sniping I've hit a bit of a hurdle. Going through all the Aust War Memorial records (eg war diaries, Establishment & Equipment Tables, photo's. etc) I have been unable to determine if the 2nd AIF's inf battalions were issued with sniper rifles for their service in Middle East, Greece or Crete. This includes old WWI SMLE MkIII* T, SMLE Mk.III* H or even P14s. The 9th Div appears to have had them by the time of their defence of Tobruk in Apr 1941, and the Indep / Cmdo Coys had them in early 42, and the battalions had them for the Pacific Campaign (1942 on), but I can find no evidence that they were available for Western Desert Campaign (eg. Bardia), Greece or Crete, even though the Germans definately had proper sniper rifles.
    Can anyone assist?
    Cheers, Glenn
    Information
    Warning: This is a relatively older thread
    This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

  2. # ADS
    Friends and Sponsors
    Join Date
    October 2006
    Location
    Milsurps.Com
    Posts
    All Threads
    A Collector's View - The SMLE Short Magazine Lee Enfield 1903-1989. It is 300 8.5x11 inch pages with 1,000+ photo’s, most in color, and each book is serial-numbered.  Covering the SMLE from 1903 to the end of production in India in 1989 it looks at how each model differs and manufacturer differences from a collecting point of view along with the major accessories that could be attached to the rifle. For the record this is not a moneymaker, I hope just to break even, eventually, at $80/book plus shipping.  In the USA shipping is $5.00 for media mail.  I will accept PayPal, Zelle, MO and good old checks (and cash if you want to stop by for a tour!).  CLICK BANNER to send me a PM for International pricing and shipping. Manufacturer of various vintage rifle scopes for the 1903 such as our M73G4 (reproduction of the Weaver 330C) and Malcolm 8X Gen II (Unertl reproduction). Several of our scopes are used in the CMP Vintage Sniper competition on top of 1903 rifles. Brian Dick ... BDL Ltd. - Specializing in British and Commonwealth weapons Specializing in premium ammunition and reloading components. Your source for the finest in High Power Competition Gear. Here at T-bones Shipwrighting we specialise in vintage service rifle: re-barrelling, bedding, repairs, modifications and accurizing. We also provide importation services for firearms, parts and weapons, for both private or commercial businesses.
     

  3. #2
    Advisory Panel
    Peter Laidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    10-20-2024 @ 05:01 AM
    Location
    Abingdon, Oxfordshire. The home of MG Cars
    Posts
    16,569
    Real Name
    Peter Laidler
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    12:18 AM
    Where you get operations - and even peace time where you get pooled resources you'll find that units are issued with whatever's in the Ordnance dumps at the time. For a start, the desert isn't a suitable place for sniping but Greece and Crete, where the poms were, then if they had snipers you can bet your socks that the rifles will have been issued out to the others too. Whether they were odds and sods or the by then standard No4T is a matter of pure conjecture

    That's just my experience with weaponry, vehicles, spares, vehicles and as one who's had to eat Gurkha or Malay food for a week or so, even rations!

  4. Avoid Ads - Become a Contributing Member - Click HERE
  5. #3
    FREE MEMBER
    NO Posting or PM's Allowed
    trooper554877's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Last On
    02-12-2013 @ 03:19 AM
    Location
    southwest western australia
    Age
    58
    Posts
    285
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    07:18 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Laidlericon View Post
    Where you get operations - and even peace time where you get pooled resources you'll find that units are issued with whatever's in the Ordnance dumps at the time. For a start, the desert isn't a suitable place for sniping but Greece and Crete, where the poms were, then if they had snipers you can bet your socks that the rifles will have been issued out to the others too. Whether they were odds and sods or the by then standard No4T is a matter of pure conjecture

    That's just my experience with weaponry, vehicles, spares, vehicles and as one who's had to eat Gurkha or Malay food for a week or so, even rations!
    Bit spicy for my liking!!

  6. #4
    Contributing Member muffett.2008's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Last On
    Today @ 04:33 AM
    Location
    Scone, NSW. Australia
    Posts
    2,186
    Real Name
    kevin muffett
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    10:18 AM
    Fish heads and rice.


    But to add to the original Question, An ex 2/2M.G Battalion member, who belonged to my rifle club until he passed, used to tell the odd story of using their best marksmen to protect the gun teams from sniper fire.
    It seems that the opposition(not those ones with 5 reverse gears) would try to pinpoint the guns and take the crew out at the start of an attack.
    He was employed in this role for awhile, it seems that being a rifle club man got you some cushy jobs sometimes.
    I guess it was up to the unit C.O, but I remember reading something similar with one of the Inf. Battalions in the desert campaigns, 48th?
    Last edited by muffett.2008; 06-19-2012 at 06:31 AM.

  7. #5
    FREE MEMBER
    NO Posting or PM's Allowed
    trooper554877's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Last On
    02-12-2013 @ 03:19 AM
    Location
    southwest western australia
    Age
    58
    Posts
    285
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    07:18 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by muffett.2008 View Post
    Fish heads and rice.


    But to add to the original Question, An ex 2/2M.G Battalion member, who belonged to my rifle club until he passed, used to tell the odd story of using their best marksmen to protect the gun teams from sniper fire.
    It seems that the opposition(not those ones with 5 reverse gears) would try to pinpoint the guns and take the crew out at the start of an attack.
    He was employed in this role for awhile, it seems that being a rifle club man got you some cushy jobs sometimes.
    I guess it was up to the unit C.O, but I remember reading something similar with one of the Inf. Battalions in the desert campaigns, 48th?
    but did they have sniper rifles as we know it?
    Could have been the 2/28th Bn.
    korean rat packs are even worse!
    Frenchicon foriegn legion are nearly all tinned fish as well, at least the oes we had.
    cheers fellas
    ned

  8. #6
    Advisory Panel
    Peter Laidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    10-20-2024 @ 05:01 AM
    Location
    Abingdon, Oxfordshire. The home of MG Cars
    Posts
    16,569
    Real Name
    Peter Laidler
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    12:18 AM
    Shooting a rifle prone in the desert is like firing a WOMBAT anti tank gun in many ways. The most unpopular bit is that you can never hide the xxxxing dust cloud and secondly, you can be assured that they WILL see you and then the mortars start. The ranging shot will always be too far, but the next one will be on target!

  9. Thank You to Peter Laidler For This Useful Post:


  10. #7
    Legacy Member Mk VII's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Last On
    10-08-2024 @ 03:09 PM
    Location
    England
    Age
    63
    Posts
    1,418
    Real Name
    James West
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    12:18 AM
    There wasn't much sniping done in the desert and units which had got un-sniper-conscious in the Middle East had to learn the lesson all over again in NW Europe.

  11. #8
    Contributing Member muffett.2008's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Last On
    Today @ 04:33 AM
    Location
    Scone, NSW. Australia
    Posts
    2,186
    Real Name
    kevin muffett
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    10:18 AM
    I'm afraid I would disagree about the middle east being all desert.
    There is certainly a mixed bag of terrain, represented in the pictorial shots of our units there, ranging from loverly mediteranian climate areas, rocky mountainous terrain, snow, the list goes on.

  12. #9
    Advisory Panel
    Peter Laidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    10-20-2024 @ 05:01 AM
    Location
    Abingdon, Oxfordshire. The home of MG Cars
    Posts
    16,569
    Real Name
    Peter Laidler
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    12:18 AM
    It's not that muffer......., you've got to hide and stalk, gather intelligence and if need be, shoot. AND, be within walking back distance too. So while you're fighting armies that abide by codes of war, things are different but they change when you're not. And working afar in pairs is not healthy. I'd really like to be able to say more

  13. #10
    Contributing Member muffett.2008's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Last On
    Today @ 04:33 AM
    Location
    Scone, NSW. Australia
    Posts
    2,186
    Real Name
    kevin muffett
    Local Date
    11-01-2024
    Local Time
    10:18 AM
    That's now Pete, back then it was opertunity and high profile targets.
    Stupid tank crews not closed down, anti tank gunners, patrols trying to pinpoint key locations.
    Alex Starkey, the bloke I mentioned earlier, told me he was with a team training as a ski team to carry out the odd Op. but it was later canned.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. musings while in the middle of a bout with boredom
    By Rumpelhardt in forum The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 02-17-2011, 08:35 PM
  2. Elevation comeups for all service rifles - M1/3006, M14 with M872?
    By beekeeper in forum M1 Garand/M14/M1A Rifles
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-30-2010, 08:42 AM
  3. How to find out what rifles issued to CW unit?
    By bigstick61 in forum Black Powder
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 10-17-2009, 05:49 AM
  4. My middle son and I, he just graduated Basic
    By Critch in forum The Watering Hole OT (Off Topic) Forum
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 09-12-2009, 09:13 AM
  5. Where flash hiders issued for M1's that were not sniper models?
    By gary25 in forum M1 Garand/M14/M1A Rifles
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 04-04-2009, 12:26 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts