A modest proposal

[jon_norstog]

To the list:

Every 10 years or so there seems to be a push for universal health insurance, and it gets stuck in political fighting ... I think we should push for an expansion of the VA system, a clinic in every town, a hospital in every city, and eligibility for veterans, their spouses and children. And maybe their parents, too.

This comes from my early years when I was living on the edge. I had my first wife trained pretty well: if anything happens to me, just get me to the VA hospital. In those days a lot of veterans were poor, like me. In fact we were poor because we served. If we had dodged he draft we could have gotten into those fat jobs that started drying up just as the Vietnam War was winding down. I'm doing OK now, but I think a lot of veterans and their families are not.

I'm thinking that maybe half, maybe more of the uninsured in America could be covered through VA this way. Maybe combine VA with Indian Health Service for off-reservation Indians so you build one good hospital in Phoenix, Albuquerque, Minneapolis, instead of two second-rate ones.

This isn't much about guns, I know, but think about it. How many of us are veterans? How many of us can cover if their wife, children, parents, need hospital care?

I keep writing my Senator, Congressman, etc. on this topic. Universal health care is gonna be a big fight, but we could beef up the VA system a lot easier, 'cause it's already in place.

I got no illusions. I had friends killed by VA doctors. But even an imperfect system is better than nothing. And I think it would even save money, by taking care of a lot of the people who now end up as indigent cases in the emergency rooms of local hospitals.

Well I could go on and on and on. But thinkabout it, OK?

jn

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Louis of PA]

If you are talking about Vets only, I think they are already covered by the VA system.

As for the rest of us, I see no reason to provide greater power to the government.

If you like what OPEC does with the supply of oil, then you'll like universal health care, along with its control of who can be treated for what, setting prices for doctors, and what medicines can be provided.

I don't like monopolies like OPEC or any other kind of monopoly. I ESPECIALLY don't like my own government to have a monopoly over my health care.

In the U.S., the percentage of men who have had a colonoscopy is up around 75 percent. In Canada, where tests are rationed, it's around 25 percent.

This means that if I'd lived in Canada, I might be dead by now. My colon tumor was discovered early and treated properly.

No way do I want my government or any other group to have a monopoly over my health care.

Regards,

Louis of PA

Here is what one doctor recently submitted to Hugh Hewitt.com:

Dr. R. in CO:
My background, inspired by my sister's new husband, a great cardiac surgeon, I decided to become a physician around age 12. Ironically, money had nothing to do with it, but now that I am close to retirement, I am sure glad I that made some. Physician's pay is about to plummet.

The type of person who will be applying to medical school in the future will be a lot different than me and my classmates. I spent part of my 4th year of medical school in London and saw the future.

Students there knew they were going to be low paid but secure drones and didn't work very hard. I knew that I had unlimited possibilities if I worked hard. I did work very hard, both in training and in practice, and I view myself as a great success.

As a student in London, I was in the library reading journals every spare moment. The only English student I ever saw there ( in the library) was planning on going to the States after graduation to do a residency in neurosurgery. None were available in England (topic for another day).

All the other students were going to be primary care doctors. They had no other choice. They did no extra studying, just got through the program. They were going to be sent to the equivalent of Appalachia to do primary care for quite a few years to achieve payback for their education.

One of my fellow physicians is a refugee from Canada. He say that it took about two years to implement fully the one-payer system there. Then, healthcare providers got paid under the system just great for the next two years.

Then, they ran out of money.

Payments were slashed, waiting lists established, and denial of care ( a more realistic term than rationing) was under way. I believe that last year the Supreme Court in Canada ruled that access to a waiting list does not constitute medical care.

This came after a man was told to wait months to get an MR scan to find his brain tumor. He didn't wait, but came to the States and had his brain tumor detected in a matter of days.

He returned to Canada to be told that it would take months for him to get in to see a neurosurgeon and some time after that to actually have an operation in a hospital. He went South again and once more had appropriate treatment in a matter of days. The Canadian system declined to pay for the US care and the lawsuit followed.

Where are we going to go when we are denied care here? Mexico?, Thailand?, Singapore?, Costa Rica?

Finally, a word about the "uninsured". These folks, estimated to number ~46 million, are one of the big drivers pushing the nation to a one-payer system.

Study after study has shown that most of these patients are 1) eligible for gov't programs already,2) transiently uninsured because of job change, 3) making good money but have elected not to buy insurance, 4) illegal aliens.

The hardcore long-term uninsured only number 10 to 15 million. In a nation of 300 million, this really should not be a big problem. Providing some level of care for the 3-5% that are truly uninsurable should not be a justification for screwing things up for everybody else.

[John Kepler]

"Modest proposal"????? "...a clinic in every town, a hospital in every city, and eligibility for veterans, their spouses and children. And maybe their parents, too."? The best description I ever read of nonsense like this is "A system with the efficiency of the Post Office and the compassion of the IRS!".

BTW, you bothered to calculate how much this is going to cost, and just WHO do you propose strong-arming into paying for it? Your "think about it" comment should be followed, and include a little look at the numbers!

"If you think there's such a thing as a "free lunch"...check the cost of the beer!" R.A. Heinlein

[Hank Stone]

jon_norstog,Your right about VA Doctors being bad probably graduating last in the class,I only use the VA for prescription drug refills.

[Bill Hollinger]

Second to prison doctors!

[Vern Humphrey]

In the name of Holy Gilhoole, why? Why do we want the government in charge of health care?

As someone else already said, "A government-run health care system will have all the effeciency of the Post Office and all the compassion of the IRS."

Let the government get out of the way -- for example, repeal the laws that forbid people for shopping for health insurance across state lines, or prevent unaffiliated businesses from banding together to bargain for employee health insurance from a position of strength.

Let the government authorize true Medical Savings Accounts. The fundamental principle behind Medical Savings Accounts (MSA) is that you buy cheap, high-deductible catastrophic health insurance, and then save an amount each year equal to the deductible with tax-free dollars. You use that money to cover any medical expenses up to the deductible. You roll any unused dollars over at the end of each year into your IRA. The institution holding the MSA would issue a credit card, and this card would be used to pay for health care. This would have several important impacts:

1. Paperwork makes up from one-third (in private health plans) to two-thirds (in government programs) of the total cost of health care. The use of this credit card approach would dramatically reduce the paperwork and result in lower costs.

2. The current systems of paying for health care have long delays built in. The pay-on-the-spot approach would allow care providers to further lower costs.

3. MSAs provide an incentive for people to bargain for health care -- when people spend their own money (and know they can keep all they save), they have an incentive to bargain for better rates.

4. MSAs provide an incentive to avoid over-consumption of medical care.

People who cannot afford MSAs can apply for assistance, based on their most recent tax return, and would receive proportionate assistance -- not an automatic 100%. They would get help with insurance premiums and with each payment from their MSA -- so they would always have the chance to save something by bargaining and not over-consuming.

Young people would especially benefit from this -- since they could build up substantial savings in their healthiest years.

[PhillipM]

The original "modest proposal" was to eat people if I recall my Jonathan Swift correctly. My mother worked as a nurse in the VA for over 25 years. She retired and took up other activities, occasionally working as contract labor in her old job to help cover for vacations and illnesses. Recently, at the age of 75, she volunteered more time and quit the Lion's club so she could work more to serve veterans. In her opinion, the problem with the VA is ADMINISTRATION. She estimates there are more paper pushers than health care providers. When you remove profit from a system, all that remains are bureaucrats on a self preservation career track. My allergist, one of the top in the country, used to work at the VA with my mom, he said there were some great people there but when he would order a test or a procedure, red tape bogged the system down till it affected patient care. I shudder to think what would happen if the government operated the rest of the hospitals. And while I'm on my rant, if done correctly health care doesn't cost a fortune. When you pay your deductible and the insurance company gets billed $20 for a tylenol, you don't give a damn, it's not your money, but it really is because it costs all of us in the long run. Look at the Shriner's hospitals. They are operated free to crippled children, being funded by various shrine activities. About 10 years ago my father was in line for potentate and saw the numbers, the shriners had over a billion in the bank. At the time they were forecast to operate all six hospitals off just the interest on their investments. The recent stock market debacle probably blew that off track but let that fact soak in, six hospitals, no patient costs, all running off interest. Let's see Obama do that! +1 on the MSA. The closer the consumer is to the provider the better. I let my primary care doctor know that years ago and I get the free samples instead of a high dollar prescription. The best thing about the MSA though is it pays 100% after your deductible per year. Mine is $2650, pretty steep, but if I get cancer or have to get a heart transplant, that's all I'll ever pay, up to $8 million lifetime. If I'm so messed up $8 mil can't fix me, just put me out of my misery.

[Johnny Peppers]

In her opinion, the problem with the VA is ADMINISTRATION.

Look at anything the government has a hand in and you will find mountains of paperwork. The more paperwork, the more people required to create more mountains of paperwork.
Having taken my uncle who is a WWII veteran to the closest VA hospital, I can tell you that there is a lot of sitting and waiting between filling out forms.

[Dave]

I am a vet, only four years, one was in Korea. I am sick and tired of vets ( and others, like older people; think AARP) who are consently winning for free benefits cause they "served". The only vets who should be treated by VA are "service connected" cases. Go ahead and flame, if you must. I have always taken care of myself and family and in the present situation that is getting more difficult (retired). And no, I didn't have oppurtunity for college, (4 of my 4 kids did, # 4 didn't want it) never even graduated from hi-school. I just worked hard and took courses to learn more. I am not bragging, just that I was brought up to do for myself. I was born in the depression, I learned the hard way, thru my parents.