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Thread: M1 Carbine-Barrel picked out & finished by Eric Johnson stock made by Robert Owen

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  1. #1
    Member Ricks4654's Avatar
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    M1 Carbine-Barrel picked out & finished by Eric Johnson stock made by Robert Owen

    My dad has an M1icon carbine that he is giving me. The gun was made for my grandfather (David Stamy) during WWII at a dodge factory that he worked at somewhere in Michigan. I guess they made guns there during the war. The story is that Robert Owen had made stocks for Teddy Roosevelt. I have some paperwork on the gun and that is the names of the two guys that it says made the gun. Anyway, it's a nice gun and it's only been fired maybe 10 tens at the most. I think we took it deer hunting once in Texas which is where I was born. My father is originally from Michigan but was billeted at Ellington Field between Houston and Galveston after the war. He was a navigator/bombadier in B-24s flying out of Italyicon. The gun has a blued barrel on it but the peep sights on it are parkerized. Just wondering if any of you guys can add to the story on this gun. It is not for sale so I really don't need to know what it is worth.
    Thanks,
    Rick Stamy

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  3. #2
    Member Ricks4654's Avatar
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    Thread Starter

    Crickets

    Chirp!

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    Senior Member stickhauler's Avatar
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    Well, if it's a USGI carbine, it was not made at a Dodge factory anywhere, they didn't have a contract to build M-1 Carbines. If it was made in Michigan, it was made at either Saginaw Gear in Saginaw, or Irwin-Penderson/Saginaw Gear in Grand Rapids. Saginaw Gear took over the contract Irwin-Penderson had been given as their production wasn't getting accepted by the Ordinance Department. Saginaw Gear was a division of GM, just as Inland was. Inland built their carbines in Dayton, Ohio. Actually built them in a factory they had bought off of the Wright Brothers, their old aircraft engine production plant.

    If I recall correctly, Rock Ola made the stocks for them, they'd be marked RMC in the sling well on the left side of the stock.

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    Member Ricks4654's Avatar
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    Thank you stickhauler. I'm trying to piece together the history of the gun and I appreciate your info. I just got off the phone with my 90 year old dad and he said the gun was made in Ohio at a place owned by Doc Reed called Standard Products. I got it wrong about the Dodge plant. If you know anything about the Standard Products factory I would love to hear about it. So my grandfather worked for Doc Reed. It's funny how you can start to piece together these things on the internet. Thanks again for the info.
    Rick Stamy
    Quote Originally Posted by stickhauler View Post
    Well, if it's a USGI carbine, it was not made at a Dodge factory anywhere, they didn't have a contract to build M-1 Carbines. If it was made in Michigan, it was made at either Saginaw Gear in Saginaw, or Irwin-Penderson/Saginaw Gear in Grand Rapids. Saginaw Gear took over the contract Irwin-Penderson had been given as their production wasn't getting accepted by the Ordinance Department. Saginaw Gear was a division of GM, just as Inland was. Inland built their carbines in Dayton, Ohio. Actually built them in a factory they had bought off of the Wright Brothers, their old aircraft engine production plant.

    If I recall correctly, Rock Ola made the stocks for them, they'd be marked RMC in the sling well on the left side of the stock.

  7. #5
    Senior Member stickhauler's Avatar
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    Standard Products M-1 Carbines were produced in Port Clinton, Ohio, very near Camp Perry, OH.

    From the CMPicon forums:

    Carbine Manufacturers, where are they today? - CMP Forums

    Standard Products - Standard Products was founded around 1930 By Dr. James Sims Reid. He was a physician turned inventor and his first automotive invention was an improved gas cap for automobiles which he marketed thru his own Easy-on-Cap Co which he sold to Eaton Axle Co. His experiments with steel tape led to patents for flexible window channels to ease the opening and closing of automobile windows. The company branched out to other automotive products. During WWII Standard Products received a contract to produce M-1 Carbines. By 1954, all cars made in the U.S. contained at least one of Standard's products, and some had as many as fifty. In 1962, James R. Reid, jr. assumed control of the company from his father and ushered it through a period of continued expansion that lasted into the 1990s. In 1996, the company's sales reached $1.08 billion. In 1997, James S. Reid, jr. was replaced by Ronald L. Roudebush as Chief Executive Officer and Vice Chairman of the company. In 1999, Findlay, Ohio-based tire maker Cooper Tire and Rubber Co. purchased Standard Products for $757.4 million in stock and an assumption of Standard's debt. A combination of manufacturing and licensing arrangements has allowed Standard Products to be involved with almost every automobile on the road. Its products appear on more than 100 car, van, and light truck models manufactured worldwide.

    From M-1 Family Forum:

    A little history of Standard Products and its carbines. : Standard Products

    Standard Products

    -Main Manufacture and identification codes: "S" "STD-PROD"
    -Main plant location: Port Clinton, Ohio.
    -Average Cost to Government per completed rifle, $53.79
    -Approximately 247,160 total Carbines were made by Standard Products: About 4.0% of M1 Carbines made.

    --M1 Carbines 247,160 (Standard Products, did not make the M2, M3, T3, or M1A1icon Carbines)

    -Serial number blocks assigned by the government:

    --1st block, serial number: 1,982,500 - 2,352,519 | April, 1943 - May, 1944




    -Primary stock & hand guard supplier: Hillerich & Bradsby and Jamestown Lounge.

    -Barrel suppliers: Inland, Buffalo Arms, Underwood, I.B.M., Marlin, Winchester

    -Parts made directly by Underwood: Bolts, Receivers, Trigger housings, Slides

    -Side notes:

    --Only used about half of the serial numbers that were assigned to them by the Government.

    --Standard Products was contracted by the Government after WWII to rebuild and retrofit M1 Carbines, so they would be ready for future use and long term storage. (This is where they added the Bayonet lug and adjustable rear sights.)

    -All matching vs how it left the factory:

    ****** There is a difference between an all matching carbine and how it left the factory, a lot of M1 Carbine contractors shipped parts to other Contractors. Just because its all matching doesn't necessary mean that is how it left the factory. So don't get super disappointing if your Carbine is not all matching, its possible its exactly how it was when it left the factory!!! An example say Underwood was low on sears, Inland would ship some Sears to them. Sometimes marked or unmarked. Here is some known shipments to National Postal Meter, how ever there could be more shipments that occurred that are unknown but this is a good reference. (most parts were shipped together in groups, magazine catches with sears, etc)

    (Organized by year 1943 - 1944)

    --I.B.M. shipped approximately 10,000 barrels to Standard Products in 1943.
    --I.B.M. shipped approximately 10,000 trigger housings to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Inland shipped approximately 1,000 barrels to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Inland shipped approximately 10,000 recoil plates to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Inland shipped approximately 1,000 triggers to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Inland shipped approximately 10,000 trigger housings to Standard Products in 1944.
    --NPM shipped approximately 4,000 hammers to Standard Products in 1943.
    --NPM shipped approximately 12,000 extractors to Standard Products in 1943.
    --NPM shipped approximately 2,000 sears to Standard Products in 1943.
    --NPM shipped approximately 2,000 triggers to Standard Products in 1943.
    --NPM shipped approximately 10,000 rear flip sights to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Rock-Ola shipped approximately 1,000 sears to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Underwood shipped approximately 4,500 triggers to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Underwood shipped approximately 1,500 firing pins to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Underwood shipped approximately 10,000 recoil plates to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Underwood shipped approximately 10,000 barrels to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Winchester shipped approximately 850 hammers to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Winchester shipped approximately 950 recoil plates to Standard Products in 1943.
    --Winchester shipped approximately 5,000 barrels to Standard Products in 1943.


    Example: You have an all matching Standard Products carbine with a Rock-Ola sear, its possible it left the factory just like that.

    Please feel free to PM me or post for any errors or any further information.

    -Thanks.

    -Some history of Standard Products:
    -Standard Products was founded around 1930 By Dr. James Sims Reid. He was a physician turned inventor and his first automotive invention was an improved gas cap for automobiles which he marketed thru his own Easy-on-Cap Co which he sold to Eaton Axle Co. His experiments with steel tape led to patents for flexible window channels to ease the opening and closing of automobile windows. The company branched out to other automotive products. During WWII Standard Products received a contract to produce M-1 Carbines. By 1954, all cars made in the U.S. contained at least one of Standard's products, and some had as many as fifty. In 1962, James R. Reid, jr. assumed control of the company from his father and ushered it through a period of continued expansion that lasted into the 1990s. In 1996, the company's sales reached $1.08 billion. In 1997, James S. Reid, jr. was replaced by Ronald L. Roudebush as Chief Executive Officer and Vice Chairman of the company. In 1999, Findlay, Ohio-based tire maker Cooper Tire and Rubber Co. purchased Standard Products for $757.4 million in stock and an assumption of Standard's debt. A combination of manufacturing and licensing arrangements has allowed Standard Products to be involved with almost every automobile on the road. Its products appear on more than 100 car, van, and light truck models manufactured worldwide.

    I would like to say thanks to "dpd3672" For this information and History of Standard Products, you can find more info and his orginal post over on the CMP forums here: Carbine Manufacturers, where are they today? - CMP Forums

  8. The Following 2 Members Say Thank You to stickhauler For This Useful Post:


  9. #6
    Member Ricks4654's Avatar
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    Thanks stickhauler

    Thanks for all the info. I will post pics of the gun when I get it or the next time I go home for a visit. I'm in no hurry to aquire it as my dad will likely have to pass away before I get it. Actually he has offered it to me already but it is quite dear to him since it did come from his dad so I'm hesitant to take it now and I'm really not sure what all the legal requirements would be to ship an assault rifle from Texas to Southern California. I've asked at a few shops around here and they all say to do it legally you have to have it shipped through a licensed gun dealer. That seems like a lot of nonsense to me. I will probably just drive back to Texas and carry it back with me when the inevitable finally happens. I appreciate all the info. I will try and take pictures of it when I go back for my next visit. I now know where to look for all the serial numbers and maker marks. This will only add to history of the gun and I look forward to passing it down to my son with a more complete story. Thanks again for all the information. I realize I probably posted this under the wrong forum heading but I did get some very useful information and for this I am thankful.
    Sincerely,
    Rick

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    Senior Member stickhauler's Avatar
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    Sadly, since you live in California, you'd be unable to have it transferred to you with the normal 15 round magazine, and I'm not even sure it's legal to own there, I can't remember how strict their laws are on such rifles. I believe it may be legal, as there's a guy that runs a place called Riverbank Armory that sells carbine parts, and even complete carbines. Hint: Don't deal with him, as his fame for selling fake parts is legend in the collecting community.

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