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Thread: "DA" Marked Ross rifles; Serial number listing from HMS Canada

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    Contributing Member boltaction's Avatar
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    Good afternoon all: There was a posting on Rossrifle.com discussing the "DA" marked Ross Mk III rifles. These rifles were given by Canadaicon to Great Britain in 1916 in exchange for SMLEs, and many were then issued to the Royal Marines and used on board ship and other places. One battleship, HMS Canada, had been ordered by Chileicon prior to the start of WWI, but was then bought instead by Britain in 1914 before delivery. It was then given to Chile at the war's end, and the Ross rifles with accompanying bayonets which were on board went with it; the ship was renamed the Almirante Latorre. The Chilean Navy stamped the rifles and bayonets with a DA number.



    These rifles were brought out of Chile in the 1980's or so, and surface from time to time. Most are early production, 1914-1915, and have CEF issue stampings still on them in addition to later Britishicon and Chilean stampings. The "DA" stamp and accompanying number are always on the left receiver rail of the rifle, and the DA and number are always on the crossguard of the bayonet. It is believed there were around 500 such rifles.

    On the Rossrifle.com thread, many members listed their rifles, so I compiled the rifles mentioned into order, listing the rifle DA #, actual serial number and date of rifle if available or legible, whether or not it has its matching bayonet, and bayonet # if not matching,the location of the rifle in terms of continent, and any comments, like mismatched bolt. We have a couple of "bayonet only" as well.

    From the photos some have sent me, and from my own DA rifles, quite a few seem to have M and a number stamped on the top of the stock, and a couple have a RM and # on the side of the stock, presumably Marine or Royal Marine markings. A few of the bayonets have an M and number on the wood, suggesting some sort of rack number perhaps put on by the Brits before being sent to Chile, which makes sense; these rifles and bayonets would have had to be in Royal Marine hands and on the ship when it was sent to Chile. Either by serial number or by description sent to me, most, not all, of these rifles are early--1914-1916 and have the early style front band, and many have CEF markings on them.

    Interestingly, some rifles seem to have DA numbered bolts, some do not (some match, some don't). So, either these rifles did not all have their bolts numbered, or else a number of bolts were lost and just replaced (perhaps on import?) with bolts from other Rosses. The latter seems unlikely, but I'm not sure why some would have had bolts numbered with the DA stamp and some not. Unless of course some were on the ships, and some were on shore, and one or the other had the bolts stored separately?

    Anyway, if anyone wants to add to the table, they can contact me by pm and I will update the list on both sites. I am hoping that posting this here will catch the attention of others with DA marked Ross Mk III rifles, and perhaps they can PM me with the details of their rifle--the DA number, date and serial number if legible, whether or not it has a matching bayonet with it, etc, and then the list can be updated. Likewise, if anyone has a DA marked bayonet only they would like to list, we could match it up to its rifle, possibly, and it should be simple enough to arrange for a DA marked bayonet owner to get a standard non DA marked Ross bayonet in exchange should they so wish.

    Note that DA12 and DA 21 are the same rifle, but it is hard to know which is the typo. Cheers Ed


    DA12, DATE 1915, SN# *684FP, has matching bayonet, located in Canada, was listed in Edgecomb’s Defending the Dominion
    DA21, DATE 1915, SN# *684FP, has matching bayonet, in ON Canada NOTE: This is the same rifle as above. The original post lists DA21, the book by David states DA12. *One is wrong....
    DA19, DATE and SN# is unknown, unknown if has matching bayonet or not. In Australiaicon
    DA33, DATE 1918, SN# 433OX, has matching bayonet, in the USAicon
    DA44, DATE 1915, SN# 169GG, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada—AB. NOTE: Bolt # is DA 129 *M290 stamped on stock wrist. Bayonet has 188 stamped into wood, no metal stamp.
    DA67, DATE 1916, SN# 900 rest illegible, unknown if has matching bayonet or not, in Australia, NOTE: Bolt # is DA 58
    DA72, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, in Australia, NOTE: Bayonet and scabbard US marked
    DA88, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, in Australia, NOTE: Bolt # is DA115
    DA98, DATE 1914, SN# 448ED, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA120, DATE 1915,SN# illegible, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA148, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, in Australia
    DA170, DATE and SN# illegible, has matching bayonet, in Canada
    DA175, NOTE: REceiver and bolt only, (both are numbered), in US
    DA176, DATE 1915, SN# 328FV, unknown if has matching bayonet, in Canada
    DA181, DATE 1916, SN# 243HP, has bayonet, but not matching, Bayonet number is DA317, in Canada—NS
    DA188, DATE and SN# unknown, unknown if has matching bayonet, had been noted on another forum
    DA190, DATE 1916, SN# 270GS, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA209, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, imported from Canada to US in 1999 NOTE: reported by BDLicon
    DA214, DATE and SN# unknown at present, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA254, DATE unknown, SN# 438, has matching bayonet, imported from Canada to US in 1999 NOTE: reported by BDL
    DA264, DATE 1915, SN# 328EO, has matching bayonet, in Canada—SK
    DA286 BAYONET ONLY, in Canada, from another member. BAYONET ONLY
    DA300 “range”, DATE and SN# unknown, noted in Franceicon, no other details
    DA300, DATE and SN# unknown, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada--?ON
    DA312, DATE and SN# Worn and illegible, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA320, DATE 1915, SN# 990GJ, has matching bayonet , in South Africa. M281 also stamped into small of butt
    DA329, DATE 1915, SN# 779FR, has matching bayonet, in New Zealand. NOTE M49 stamped on top of wrist
    DA335, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet
    DA364, DATE 1914 SN# 281DR, does not have matching bayonet, in Australia
    DA366, DATE and SN# unknown, had matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA371 BAYONET ONLY, in New Zealand, NOTE: Seen in auction BAYONET ONLY
    DA386, DATE 1915, SN# 175GO, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada
    DA395 BAYONET ONLY, in USA, BAYONET ONLY
    DA398, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, from David Edgecomb in Canada, NOTE: Mentioned in “Defending the Dominion” book, as having sold at Gunscanada auction
    DA401 BAYONET ONLY, in Canada, BAYONET ONLY
    DA416, DATE 1914 SN# 343EB, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA426, DATE unknown, SN# A1625, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada, NOTE: Anomalous SN, but has all early production features and a CEF 16 issue stamping, so clearly early and saw action. NOTE: DA number is engraved, not stamped, bolt is stamped with matching number, stock has 4 holes drilled on stock perhaps for a hasp.

    The end thus far...........
    Last edited by boltaction; 11-09-2013 at 10:29 AM.

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  4. #2
    Advisory Panel Brian Dick's Avatar
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    Here's two more for your list. DA209 and DA254. Both imported to the USAicon from Canadaicon and sold here in 1999. Both were lovely original rifles with matching bayonets.

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    Contributing Member boltaction's Avatar
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    Added to the list above. Thx Brian

    Ed

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    The serial number of DA254 is 438. Not sure of a suffix. I've got no serial number listed for DA209 in my bound book.

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    DA 426 is marked to 16 Battalion, CEF.

    The anomalous serial number is all it has. On another site (CGN), recently ran into another rifle with a similar low serial number, marked with what appear to be the same punches; even the "A" was slightly elevated before the Number, as my rifle. This second rifle was sportered after WW2, was definitely an RMLI rifle, did NOT serve in Chileicon.

    DA 426 has 4 holes in the Left side of the stock. These form two sets of 2, exactly 1 inch apart horizontally, separated vertically by 7/8 of an inch. The rearmost holes are just ahead of a vertical line drawn downwards from the front of the Bolt Stop. I assume these were for a hasp of some sort. Do any other rifles exhibit this feature?

    The Bolt on DA 426 IS numbered to match the rifle. Chilean markings are ENGRAVED rather than STAMPED.

    DA 426 has all the earmarks of a very early production rifle. I bought it from International Firearms of Montreal in early 1976. Price was $99 plus $10 shipping to Fogo Island. Matching bayonets were $25 extra.... and I didn't have the money. Bayonets were not advertised as NUMBERS-matching, else I would have sold a kidney or something.

    It is BY FAR the most accurate iron-sight rifle I have.

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    Contributing Member boltaction's Avatar
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    Have updated the list to reflect the new information, plus an update on DA329, which was for sale at auction with bayonet separate, but was successfully kept together.

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    I have a ross with DA 389 on the left side of the receiver and also on the bolt. The stock is stamped 1916 , 705 and CEF 15 in a small round.
    Last edited by fortekor; 04-18-2014 at 04:18 AM.

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    Da 69

    Rifle and bayonet are marked DA 69 and dated 5/16. CEF 15 in a roundel and bayonet grip is stamped M-26 Rifle appears to have Serial# 206?R, and the bolt does not appear to match. It is now located in Alberta, Canadaicon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by boltaction View Post
    Good afternoon all: There was a posting on Rossrifle.com discussing the "DA" marked Ross Mk III rifles. These rifles were given by Canadaicon to Great Britain in 1916 in exchange for SMLEs, and many were then issued to the Royal Marines and used on board ship and other places. One battleship, HMS Canada, had been ordered by Chileicon prior to the start of WWI, but was then bought instead by Britain in 1914 before delivery. It was then given to Chile at the war's end, and the Ross rifles with accompanying bayonets which were on board went with it; the ship was renamed the Almirante Latorre. The Chilean Navy stamped the rifles and bayonets with a DA number.

    These rifles were brought out of Chile in the 1980's or so, and surface from time to time. Most are early production, 1914-1915, and have CEF issue stampings still on them in addition to later Britishicon and Chilean stampings. The "DA" stamp and accompanying number are always on the left receiver rail of the rifle, and the DA and number are always on the crossguard of the bayonet. It is believed there were around 500 such rifles.

    On the Rossrifle.com thread, many members listed their rifles, so I compiled the rifles mentioned into order, listing the rifle DA #, actual serial number and date of rifle if available or legible, whether or not it has its matching bayonet, and bayonet # if not matching,the location of the rifle in terms of continent, and any comments, like mismatched bolt. We have a couple of "bayonet only" as well.

    From the photos some have sent me, and from my own DA rifles, quite a few seem to have M and a number stamped on the top of the stock, and a couple have a RM and # on the side of the stock, presumably Marine or Royal Marine markings. A few of the bayonets have an M and number on the wood, suggesting some sort of rack number perhaps put on by the Brits before being sent to Chile, which makes sense; these rifles and bayonets would have had to be in Royal Marine hands and on the ship when it was sent to Chile. Either by serial number or by description sent to me, most, not all, of these rifles are early--1914-1916 and have the early style front band, and many have CEF markings on them.

    Interestingly, some rifles seem to have DA numbered bolts, some do not (some match, some don't). So, either these rifles did not all have their bolts numbered, or else a number of bolts were lost and just replaced (perhaps on import?) with bolts from other Rosses. The latter seems unlikely, but I'm not sure why some would have had bolts numbered with the DA stamp and some not. Unless of course some were on the ships, and some were on shore, and one or the other had the bolts stored separately?

    Anyway, if anyone wants to add to the table, they can contact me by pm and I will update the list on both sites. I am hoping that posting this here will catch the attention of others with DA marked Ross Mk III rifles, and perhaps they can PM me with the details of their rifle--the DA number, date and serial number if legible, whether or not it has a matching bayonet with it, etc, and then the list can be updated. Likewise, if anyone has a DA marked bayonet only they would like to list, we could match it up to its rifle, possibly, and it should be simple enough to arrange for a DA marked bayonet owner to get a standard non DA marked Ross bayonet in exchange should they so wish.

    Note that DA12 and DA 21 are the same rifle, but it is hard to know which is the typo. Cheers Ed


    DA12, DATE 1915, SN# *684FP, has matching bayonet, located in Canada, was listed in Edgecomb’s Defending the Dominion
    DA21, DATE 1915, SN# *684FP, has matching bayonet, in ON Canada NOTE: This is the same rifle as above. The original post lists DA21, the book by David states DA12. *One is wrong....
    DA19, DATE and SN# is unknown, unknown if has matching bayonet or not. In Australiaicon
    DA33, DATE 1918, SN# 433OX, has matching bayonet, in the USAicon
    DA44, DATE 1915, SN# 169GG, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada—AB. NOTE: Bolt # is DA 129 *M290 stamped on stock wrist. Bayonet has 188 stamped into wood, no metal stamp.
    DA67, DATE 1916, SN# 900 rest illegible, unknown if has matching bayonet or not, in Australia, NOTE: Bolt # is DA 58
    DA72, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, in Australia, NOTE: Bayonet and scabbard US marked
    DA88, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, in Australia, NOTE: Bolt # is DA115
    DA98, DATE 1914, SN# 448ED, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA120, DATE 1915,SN# illegible, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA148, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, in Australia
    DA170, DATE and SN# illegible, has matching bayonet, in Canada
    DA175, NOTE: REceiver and bolt only, (both are numbered), in US
    DA176, DATE 1915, SN# 328FV, unknown if has matching bayonet, in Canada
    DA181, DATE 1916, SN# 243HP, has bayonet, but not matching, Bayonet number is DA317, in Canada—NS
    DA188, DATE and SN# unknown, unknown if has matching bayonet, had been noted on another forum
    DA190, DATE 1916, SN# 270GS, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA209, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, imported from Canada to US in 1999 NOTE: reported by BDLicon
    DA214, DATE and SN# unknown at present, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA254, DATE unknown, SN# 438, has matching bayonet, imported from Canada to US in 1999 NOTE: reported by BDL
    DA264, DATE 1915, SN# 328EO, has matching bayonet, in Canada—SK
    DA286 BAYONET ONLY, in Canada, from another member. BAYONET ONLY
    DA300 “range”, DATE and SN# unknown, noted in Franceicon, no other details
    DA300, DATE and SN# unknown, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada--?ON
    DA312, DATE and SN# Worn and illegible, has matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA320, DATE 1915, SN# 990GJ, has matching bayonet , in South Africa. M281 also stamped into small of butt
    DA329, DATE 1915, SN# 779FR, has matching bayonet, in New Zealand. NOTE M49 stamped on top of wrist
    DA335, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet
    DA364, DATE 1914 SN# 281DR, does not have matching bayonet, in Australia
    DA366, DATE and SN# unknown, had matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA371 BAYONET ONLY, in New Zealand, NOTE: Seen in auction BAYONET ONLY
    DA386, DATE 1915, SN# 175GO, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada
    DA395 BAYONET ONLY, in USA, BAYONET ONLY
    DA398, DATE and SN# unknown, has matching bayonet, from David Edgecomb in Canada, NOTE: Mentioned in “Defending the Dominion” book, as having sold at Gunscanada auction
    DA401 BAYONET ONLY, in Canada, BAYONET ONLY
    DA416, DATE 1914 SN# 343EB, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada—BC
    DA426, DATE unknown, SN# A1625, does not have matching bayonet, in Canada, NOTE: Anomalous SN, but has all early production features and a CEF 16 issue stamping, so clearly early and saw action. NOTE: DA number is engraved, not stamped, bolt is stamped with matching number, stock has 4 holes drilled on stock perhaps for a hasp.

    The end thus far...........

    That's really great work,..... and deserves to be acknowledged
    Thank you

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  17. #10
    Advisory Panel green's Avatar
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    DA 303 and bt DA303

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