Arizona National Guard Savage 69 pump roit

[jeep]

Looks just like Vietnam 77e or 69 which both were used in the war,short 13-1/2"stock ,parkerized, rubber recoil pad and stock treated with anti-mold finish ,corn cob fore end ,sling swivels. Serial number pre 1968. Anyone seen one of these and what would the value be in 95% cond.

[Frederick303]

Yes, have one bought last year circa summer 2015. Retail cost was 199 plus tax and transfer or ~215 out the door. I have no idea how much they go for on the secondary market, but I would guess around 1.5 times or 300 or less. They are very ugly guns and only have a 4 shot magazine.


History on these guns:

There was also a small quantity of the Savage model 69 RH made around 1970~1971 which were identical to the Military 77E pattern, sold to local police and various state military forces but marked with the commercial 69RH marking. By identical I mean parkarized finish, sling swivels and the short buttstock with recoil pad, mold resistant black wood finish. Arizona recently sold off their National Guard 69 RH models, which were bought by phoenix distributors (in PA) and a firm in Texas. The Arizona DEMA took possession of their model 69 RH shotguns in 1971, presumably they were made in late 1970 or early 1971.

Apparently the reason (or so I was told when researching why the states would be buying arms) for such sales to various State defense forces was that around 1968~69 the federal government tightened up the regulations regarding arms storage and issue after the GCA of 1968 and the various riots in 1968. The result was that federally owned arms, held by state National Guard forces were more difficult to be issued for normal everyday base use. So some state DEMA bough their own arms for base gate guards and other constabulary duties, as such arms did not have such stringent regulations. A lot of this also had to do with the removal of the M1 from the national guard and the replacement of the rifles with the M16A1, which because of its automatic capability required a much higher level of security.

They do not seem to have been issued much, as once the Vietnam war wound down and the Post Kent state ruckus died down the harsh issue rules were abbreviated to a more reasonable set of rules.

[jeep]

They were know in Vietnam and both the 77e and 69rh made there some 50,000. Under hard use and used as a club the buttstack would break off. Still a bit of history and effective.

[Frederick303]

I do not believe any 69R-H were sent to Vietnam. The 77E was the designation of guns sold to the US government. 69R was the designation of the police guns. 69R-H were the police guns finished to the exact same finish as the 77E, but once again, commercially marked guns. The only such guns out there all seem to be on a separate serial number range than the Government 77E contract,

In the listing of Savage-Stevens contracts for Vietnam era, no 69RH guns show up, only the 77E.

Also in the US Army take down PDF, there is no mention of the 69R-H, only the 77E.

Now a lot of folks would like to be otherwise, as if so then a cheap 200 dollar guns becomes a rare US combat shotgun (big $$).



Of course I could be wrong. What is your source for the info that the 69R-H was issued in Vietnam as part of the US aid package? Not some folks posting such on the net, but an actual official source that shows issue. If you are going by the Wikipedia posting, that was changed sometime after last summer, I suspect by someone trying to sell the 69R-H guns for big money once they were on the market cheap. Prior to the sale of the Arizona guns, the posting said only 77E were issued to the CIRG.