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Thread: Reloading for the Swiss Rifles

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  1. #21
    Really Senior Member RC20's Avatar
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    I am working up with R17 as we speak. Been using it for a while, somewhat lower price and what was available and Hornady acualy listed it for 30-06 loads.



    That is some incredible drawing. I can't do stick figures but I know good work when I see it!

    That is also a beautiful rifle. If I could get mine to 1 inch I would be happy.

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  3. #22
    Senior Member Pierre's Avatar
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    Rc, there's no doubt in my mind that you can. I don't know how many k31s are in the armoury, but this one' is not a select rifle. It's just the one my son chose to work with.

    I read a lot about a k31 rifle that's capable of MOA shooting, and the truth is that most of them are. It's not just the projectile and powder selection. The case prep and neck tension are equally important, but not often worked on. Your SD being very low is very important. Coaxial alignment or the case base, neck and projectile are also a very crucial part of the formula.

    Latigo reloads on a Forster press, and only on a Forster when he wants absolute accuracy. The die "floats" and aligns itself with the case on every stroke. All of his precision dies are Redding Comp dies.







    A lot of guys will look at this and say....... "yeah, well, maybe he has time for all that"......... And it's the difference between vying for 1.25" groups and everyone putting in their 2 cents about going up a grain....... down 1.5 grains, different projectile, change powders and a thread on it some 60 posts long or......... Just posting a photo of your entirely repeatable results.

    Not magic, not rocket science.......... just dedication, and once you're there, you'll never go back.

    P

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  5. #23
    Really Senior Member amadeus76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
    Amadeus, you really don't need different dies. In the past 4 or 5 years Mfg's have come out with "specific" dies for the caliber. I really don't know how I survived with just RCBS for some 50 years. LOL
    But there is a factor involved. .287 brass can be easily resized to 7.5 and in the G11 series of rifles it works perfectly. That brass in a k31 will fail to extract about 1 time out of 25. The rim is just a bit smaller than the 7.5 brass. We now use Redding, but........... That first die some 15 years ago cost me $585.00 because it didn't exist at the time and had to be custom made. Now I see they're around $140 or so for the Deluxe set. The Bushing sizer is another $55 or so. We just happen to be big Redding Competition/Bushing die fans.

    You can just use the RCBS for everything, but that advertising hype is rather tempting, eh?
    So if I’m understanding you correctly there’s no difference between a Hornady 7.5 Swissicon die and a 7.5 Swiss K31 die?

  6. #24
    Senior Member Pierre's Avatar
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    In the "standard die" sets, other than the user's perceived quality differences, no. Both are for the k31 and the G11.
    But when it comes to the Precision and Competition dies, only the user's track record is important, and for us, Redding has no competition.
    Redding: Redding Competition Bushing 3-Die Neck Sizer Set 6.5 - MPN: 58446

    This is the best from RCBS RCBS Gold Medal Match Series Bushing 2-Die Set 224 - MPN: 11205

    "Nothing is cast in stone" with dies. Your own end result is all that's important no matter whose dies they are.

  7. #25
    Senior Member Pierre's Avatar
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    In case you missed this one:

    Competition Bushing Sizing Die -- With this die, the cartridge case is completely supported and aligned with the sizing bushing before the sizing process begins. As the sizing process starts, the cartridge case remains supported in the tightly chambered sliding sleeve as it moves upward while the resizing bushing self centers on the case neck. The decapping rod is maintained in precise alignment by using the internal parts of the die as a linear support much like a firing pin. While the micrometer adjustment of the bushing position delivers precise control to the desired amount of the neck length to be sized. (Bushings are sold separately)
    •The Body Die -- is designed to full length resize the case body only and bump the shoulder position for proper chambering without disturbing the case neck. It is intended for use only to resize cases which have become increasingly difficult to chamber after repeated firing and neck sizing.
    •Competition Seating Die -- The bullet guide to seating stem fit is so precise that the seating stem can actually be demonstrated to float on a column of air. The micrometer is calibrated in .001" increments. It also has a zero set feature that allows you to zero the micrometer to your rifle or favorite seating depth.

    Add the Coaxial press system and you have the epitome of a reloading setup. ....... and I believe there might be one or two other press Mfg's that make a coax press. I'm just old and set in my ways.

  8. #26
    Senior Member Pierre's Avatar
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    Now that you've had a chance to read about the well lubricated and smooth running gears of potential Precision Reloading, (there are more factors involved, but..) let's throw a monkey wrench into the whole thing.

    Many years ago I had a friend and two aquaintances that were bench resters. All of their reloading was done at their bench at matches.

    I'm sure you've seen the hand loading kits with the decapper, primer inserter, projectile seater etc. and......... a small yellow dipper? I have a Lyman and one other I can't remember, both in our caliber but have never used them.

    He would take a primed, prep'd case, the desired, proven projectile profile and weight, a small wide mouthed canniser of the required powder, a yellow dipper which he had filed down to the specific grain volume for the desired powder weight, dip the yellow dipper into the cannister and, with a credit card...... flick it across the top of the dipper and dump the powder into his case. He then used his hand held projectile seater and proceeded to shoot his 500 or 1,000 yard groups downrange.

    Would you like to guess as to his results? ........ so.......... Are you going to reload with a dipper and a credit card? LOL
    Only if you have an awful lot of spare hours for that methodology and, needless to say, his case prep did involve both inside and outside case mouth truing. I'll get into that later, and we actually do the inside truing. Our method produces very close to bench rest load results but is much faster in volume.

    P

  9. #27
    Really Senior Member RC20's Avatar
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    I lust after the Co-axe, sigh. I have to perfectly good Rock Chuckers (one was a hand off from a brother who no longer reloads)

    I have not figured out a way to get them setup at the same time in my limited shop (room and benches are multi use) More sigh.

    These days the goal is a Labradar. Trendy but a whole lot better than all the futzing and less use of the Crony types.

    Latest round was 15 degrees and an all too short session, the Hornady 168 ELD is showing promise, no one has the Bergers so that would be a stateside order. Bless flat rate shipping!

  10. #28
    Contributing Member Ovidio's Avatar
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    Keeping my primitive way of reloading, I shot the 180 grs. FMJBT bullets from S&B.
    I was a bit distracted, so I started lousy, but after 3 shots I could stay with the following 12 within 3.5 inches at 200 meters.
    K31icon likes slightly heavier bullets?
    34a cp., btg. Susa, 3° rgt. Alpini

  11. #29
    Senior Member Pierre's Avatar
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    RC, I used the Rockchucker for a very long time. The single most important thing to me has always been case prep. That's easily 75% of the accuracy battle.

    Ovidio, you're right. My son prefers the 190gr Hornady ELD for hunting and the Berger for targets, but truth be told, the Hornady ELD does just as well. There are a number of the new VLD type projectiles out there now with which we have no working experience, so all of them are worth trying.

    Just do the very best case prep you can and eliminate that variable. Beyond that it simply a matter of your powder selection and muzzle velocity being as narrow a scope as you can manage.

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  13. #30
    Really Senior Member RC20's Avatar
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    1000 of the H 168 ELD on the way as we speak (write)

    AK prices are really high. Far lower cost to order and flat rate them.

    I did metal shim up both ends of the K-31. The front has a serious rub mark on the lower stock. Does not look like it was shot much. Pretty clean and little but stock damage.

    No Import marks, I like that. I have seen some that were really ugly.

    The Lyman stick on jobs on the way, come spring will see what I can do with the 1911. The guy who sold it to me shot matches with it.

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