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    Member cfrewilly's Avatar
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    M91/30 Ukrainian sniper rifles

    Has anybody checked these guns for sale at Classic Fire Arms in North Carolina?
    they have matching numbers, bent bolt, threaded barrels and a scope mount, the wood under the scope looks new and the guns are full of cos. with a date of 1941. I will try ro get some pictures and write a new post.
    Thanks for any information.
    Tim



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    Senior Member Miller Tyme's Avatar
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    They are reproductions sir, some more of Sweaty Bens fantasy rifles.

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    Really Senior Member Bruce McAskill's Avatar
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    And the mounts only take the newer type system for the semi-autos and not the originals. The new system seems to stick up in the air a bit more then the originals did. Too high to get a real good hold for shooting and sticks further out to the side and not over the bore of the rifle.

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    At a big box store i have handled on of these and they are far from the genuine article. As stated earlier this is a newer scope system and truth be told it is a poor copy of the new system at that. The scope mounts are cast and seem chintzy compared to the real deal. plus these are mounted on run of the mill 91/30s, nothing super accurate or special. Matching numbers or not its a sales gimmick.
    a legitimate one will have the letters C H stamped on the top of the barrel shank meaning sniper or as they say снайпер.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewer View Post
    At a big box store i have handled on of these and they are far from the genuine article. As stated earlier this is a newer scope system and truth be told it is a poor copy of the new system at that. The scope mounts are cast and seem chintzy compared to the real deal. plus these are mounted on run of the mill 91/30s, nothing super accurate or special. Matching numbers or not its a sales gimmick.
    a legitimate one will have the letters C H stamped on the top of the barrel shank meaning sniper or as they say снайпер.
    Only Tulas have the "CH" marking, but there are some legit examples that dont.
    Izhevsks have no special markings to set them apart from standard infantry rifles.
    The best way to spot a fake is through education.

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    Senior Member Miller Tyme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vintage hunter View Post
    Only Tulas have the "CH" marking, but there are some legit examples that dont.
    Izhevsks have no special markings to set them apart from standard infantry rifles.
    The best way to spot a fake is through education.
    Izhevsk do have a special marking to denote them, they have the scope number stamped onto the left side of the barrel shank. The only exception where one might not have this is when they have had a scope swap during refurbishment where they might have ground off the old scope number and never restamped the new one, though this is usually readly discernable.

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    I suppose you could count that as a special marking if you wish, but it wasn't stamped until sometime after the conversion process. Some say it wasn't added until the rifle went through a refurb as some Tulas have it too.
    The Tula "CH", as I understand it, was stamped on the chamber during the accuracy test stage to denote the rifle showed above average accuracy. It amounts to the same thing as the "TR" on the butt socket of Enfield No.4 T's.
    Neither is a 100% reliable way to determine a legit MN sniper as they are easily faked by anybody with a stamp set. My '43 Izhevsk PU is a good example. It's a 100% honest refurb mismatch that an overly zealous pervious owner tried to "correct" by stamping the matching scope number on the barrel above the lined out original and they even went so far as to EP the rifle and scope numbers on the mount. I swapped an obvious CIA fake for it even up. Education is still the most reliable method. Originals have certain traits that the fakers cant duplicate.
    Last edited by vintage hunter; 07-04-2019 at 11:07 AM.

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    Really Senior Member Ridolpho's Avatar
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    I believe Factory #74 (Izhevsk) Sniper barrels have a circle-C stamped on them. Like the Tula CH it can be poorly stamped or faint. Also, as with Tula guns, it can be present on non-scoped rifles.

    Ridolpho

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridolpho View Post
    I believe Factory #74 (Izhevsk) Sniper barrels have a circle-C stamped on them. Like the Tula CH it can be poorly stamped or faint. Also, as with Tula guns, it can be present on non-scoped rifles.

    Ridolpho
    Ridolpho,
    The circle c mark is actually a concentric 00 and is an accuracy proof mark, it has nothing to do with snipers specifically. It merely signifies the barrel met accuracy standards. Every Izhevsh i own, '43 PU sniper, 1937 infantry rifle and 1948 M44, has it.
    Last edited by vintage hunter; 07-04-2019 at 12:22 PM.

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    Really Senior Member Ridolpho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vintage hunter View Post
    Ridolpho,
    The circle c mark is actually a concentric 00 and is an accuracy proof mark, it has nothing to do with snipers specifically. It merely signifies the barrel met accuracy standards. Every Izhevsh i own, '43 PU sniper, 1937 infantry rifle and 1948 M44, has it.
    Refer to Yuschenko, 2016, pg 101. Two distinct markings. I don't believe there is a more up to date reference than Alex's book.

    Ridolpho

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