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Thread: No.5 Mk.1 11/44 Identification Question

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  1. #1
    Member shortusaf's Avatar
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    No.5 Mk.1 11/44 Identification Question

    Hello, I just found this forum researching a No.5 Mk.1 I recently acquired so I'm brand new to the community. I enjoy collecting military surplus firearms, but I'm not very knowledgeable in the area of Enfield's. This one caught my eye due to it being like a No.5 Mk.1 my father had stolen from him in the early 1970s and I had to pick it up. Would anyone be able to assist in identifying the proof marks to include the buttstock disc? I would really like to know the history of this one? Thanks, Tony

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  3. #2
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    First time I've seen a butt disc on a #5...
    Regards, Jim

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    Contributing Member smle addict's Avatar
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    A very nice and well-travelled No5 Mk 1. Fazakerly rifle manufactured in November of 1944. The little arrows are the "broad arrow" military ownership marks. The various others are simply proof and inspection stamps. The butt-disc is a first, as those were never applied to No 5's. That certainly did not happen in UKicon service. Perhaps it was added by some foreign government or even some time during its civilian life.

    ROF (F)= Royal Ordnance Factory, Fazakerly. 11/44= November 1944, followed by serial number.

    I would advise you purchase any of Ian Skennertons "enfield" books. He has lists of proof and inspection markings in the glossary. Skip Strattons' little paperbacks on enfield collecting list quit a few as well.

    This is a thead that comes up often, re; markings. They are illustrated in the books mentioned above. To go through all the little would stamps would cause headaches and eye strain!

    Oh, and welcome to the forum. You have now been infected with "enfielditis." There is an inverse relationship to the number of enfields one owns and the dwindling dollars in ones bank account.

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    Really Senior Member Mk VII's Avatar
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    We discussed some figures about these back in 2017 https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=59352

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    Member shortusaf's Avatar
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    Thread Starter
    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    First time I've seen a butt disc on a #5...
    I agree! It’s definitely been there a while as well.

    ---------- Post added at 05:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:52 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by smle addict View Post
    A very nice and well-travelled No5 Mk 1. Fazakerly rifle manufactured in November of 1944. The little arrows are the "broad arrow" military ownership marks. The various others are simply proof and inspection stamps. The butt-disc is a first, as those were never applied to No 5's. That certainly did not happen in UKicon service. Perhaps it was added by some foreign government or even some time during its civilian life.

    ROF (F)= Royal Ordnance Factory, Fazakerly. 11/44= November 1944, followed by serial number.

    I would advise you purchase any of Ian Skennertons "enfield" books. He has lists of proof and inspection markings in the glossary. Skip Strattons' little paperbacks on enfield collecting list quit a few as well.

    This is a thead that comes up often, re; markings. They are illustrated in the books mentioned above. To go through all the little would stamps would cause headaches and eye strain!

    Oh, and welcome to the forum. You have now been infected with "enfielditis." There is an inverse relationship to the number of enfields one owns and the dwindling dollars in ones bank account.
    Thank you so much for the info and I’m definitely feeling the “Enfieldtis” lol! I’ll take a look for the book as well. The disc is such a mysterious addition without a doubt.

    ---------- Post added at 06:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:58 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Mk VII View Post
    We discussed some figures about these back in 2017 https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=59352
    Appreciate the link to the thread, you all have been extremely welcoming for my first time here, thank you!

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    Really Senior Member Daan Kemp's Avatar
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    Butt might be a replacement.

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    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daan Kemp View Post
    Butt might be a replacement.
    Sure, maybe...are you thinking it was made from a #1 butt? Disc hole present so easiest way to fill it is with a disc...?
    Regards, Jim

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    Really Senior Member Mk VII's Avatar
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    It would be a great deal of work to convert a No.1 butt just to preserve the disc hole - easier to drill the hole.

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    Really Senior Member Alan de Enfield's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daan Kemp View Post
    Butt might be a replacement.

    Some wise words from the man who knows (PL)
    Wed 2 Jan 2008 9:52 am

    Some of you will by now have noticed that there are TWO shapes inside top surface, inside the No4 rifle butt socket. The OLD ex SMLE shape with a rounded step on the right and a tapered step on the left and the post 1942 (?, but that’s what we called them …..) shape of two rounded steps.
    Officially, and according to our EMER’s, you CAN fit a double rounded stepped butt to a single round/taper step body after adjusting the wood accordingly. But you CANNOT fit a single rounded/taper step butt to a double rounded butt socket. This is because, try as you might, you’ll never truly get it tight ….., or if you do, it won’t last!
    That’s the OFFICIAL party line. But if you think that any old, wise and weary old Armourer Sergeant would allow you to wait until a stock of double rounded butts arrived, from stores in Englandicon to Korea or Aden or Malaya or wherever you were, you’re WRONG. It was quite common practice to simply dovetail, glue, patch, peg and make off the butts to get to the type you need. Simple isn’t it.
    Mine are not the best, but they are not too bad. I can think of lots of Enfields I'd rather have but instead of constantly striving for more, sometimes it's good to be satisfied with what one has...

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    Advisory Panel breakeyp's Avatar
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    I have seen/handled one or two No.5s with the unit disc in the butt. No story to tell by the seller. Apparently the price must have too high as I didn't buy it or the disc was not a big deal at the time. Still I have no remorse.

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