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Thread: Duel of the Carbines: M1 Carbine vs. M4

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  1. #11
    Really Senior Member Sunray's Avatar
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    "...M1icon has a less threatening image than..." And is still considered to be evil in some places. Our idiot government declared 'em evil in 1978 because they thought the barrel was too short. Bikers were using 'em for their nefarious and illegal business ventures.
    "...not accurate past about 200..." That's more about the particular Carbine and the shooter than anything else. The M1 Carbine was considered to be a 300 yard weapon by the U.S. military. And the .223 is still a varmint cartridge that was not designed as a battle cartridge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunray View Post
    "...M1icon has a less threatening image than..." And is still considered to be evil in some places. Our idiot government declared 'em evil in 1978 because they thought the barrel was too short. Bikers were using 'em for their nefarious and illegal business ventures.
    "...not accurate past about 200..." That's more about the particular Carbine and the shooter than anything else. The M1 Carbine was considered to be a 300 yard weapon by the U.S. military. And the .223 is still a varmint cartridge that was not designed as a battle cartridge.
    I reckon exterior ballistics play a bigger part in the accuracy of the 30 carbine beyond 150yds than gun and/or shooter. That transsonic range can play the devil on a bullets flight. The 30 C goes transsonic around 150yds.
    The round that eventually became known commercially as the 223 Remington was initially developed,beginning in 1957,and accepted in 1963 as a military cartridge under the name cartridge,5.56mm ball,M193. It wasn't produced commercially as the 223 by Remington until 1964.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunray View Post
    That's more about the particular Carbine and the shooter than anything else. The M1icon Carbine was considered to be a 300 yard weapon by the U.S. military. And the .223 is still a varmint cartridge that was not designed as a battle cartridge.
    Where do you come up with this garbage?
    Regards, Jim

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  9. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    Originally Posted by Sunray
    That's more about the particular Carbine and the shooter than anything else. The M1icon Carbine was considered to be a 300 yard weapon by the U.S. military. And the .223 is still a varmint cartridge that was not designed as a battle cartridge.
    Where do you come up with this garbage?

    Sure you want an answer........
    Charlie-Painter777

    A Country Has No Greater Responsibility Than To Care For Those Who Served...

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  11. #15
    Really Senior Member emmagee1917's Avatar
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    When the M1icon was made , it was fired on a range and the gun was handed to an adjuster who moved the rear and ground the front to hit where it needed to . It was then retested and , if passed , was handed back , staked , and sent out . When these guns came back from war and rebuilt , they were not rechecked as to POA / POI . I had 15 USGI carbines at one time and took them out and bench rested them out to 300 yds over about 6 months . One by one , I adjusted each one to hit where it should . I started out with about a refrigerator sized combined grouping but got it down to smaller than a sheet of paper . A few grouped below 2-3 inches at 100 yds , most between 3-6 inches , a few a little more . I shot "L" rear sights and milled and stamped adjustable rears . I found out most stamped rears had greater " jumps " than the milled . This was due to a reduction in pressure between WW2 and Korea ( never found records on that , but noted in the drops at 200 , 250 and 300 yards ) . If you want to try different carbines with different loads I'm sure you could come up with one that would be at least decent at 300 , but I don't think it's worth the effort . This is why I said it is a 200 yd cartridge , maybe 250 .
    Chris

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    Personally I love both rifles, both beautifully designed and highly usable platforms.

    The first time I had the opportunity to handle and field strip an M1icon Carbine, I was struck by the simplicity of the design and the ease of field stripping.

    I'm not sure the 200 plus yard comparison is fair, obviously the M1 is going to loose out badly past that point.

    200 yds is a realistic maximum range for most 'normal' applications anyway in my opinion, especially if you factor middle age eyes and open battle sights into the mix.

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