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  1. #1
    Contributing Member Ovidio's Avatar
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    Exclamation When it really happens: SHTF...

    My dear friends, these are very strange days here in Italyicon.
    My humble opinion is that an extremely bad management of the communication in these times of crises will cause our country, and also a lot of poor people, enormous damage and suffering.
    Iím talking about that damned Covid-19.
    It has hit the country hard and keeps encroaching and spreading.
    People are starting to panic and the government does not seem to be able to communicate in a reasonable way.
    Yesterday evening there was a ďleakĒ about new measures for the containment of the virus, among them the seizure of the whole of Lombardy plus 14 other provinces of the North. Practically 50% of Italyís GDP was said to be put in quarantine. The immediate reaction has been that thousands of people coming from other parts of Italy, mostly the South, immediately started moving towards home, by train, bus, car... A brainless move that will only spread the virus to the weakest parts of the country, where there is no comparable infrastructure (as here in the North) to even try and cope with this tragedy.
    There is a really unreal atmosphere here in my town these days... Everything is quiet, no schools since 10 days and already more or less confirmed closure until the 3rd of April. And that is only the start, I fear.
    Here we are still in a fairly quiet area, no real assaults yet on grocery stores, but maybe tomorrow will be different. There is now this seizure that comes to within a few kilometers from here and the chaotic situation, where no-one really knows what is real, what is fake, who knows something and who just talks because he needs to air his mouth.
    I have already learned a few very important lessons.
    1. Select your sources of information as good as you can. Leave opinion leaders, politicians and other non competent people out. Just listen to doctors, nurses and police. They are in the same boat and have clear tasks. They donít look for your vote and are normally not ideologically bent on trying to win you for some crazy idea. They are your only real and, within the limits of their competence, sincere allies.
    2. Stop moving around. Go only where you really need to go and do not overcrowd any place. Yesterday I went to the bakery in town (well before the new regulations) and saw that the place was full, although there were already provisions prohibiting to have more than three customers inside at anytime. I waited outside and told everybody after me about this. No one argued and within a few minutes the situation was under control and according to the provisions from the authorities. So, example is important. Respect all provisions and new emergency rulings and show it. Most people will automatically comply.
    3. I never had a SHTF plan, although, as a former soldier, I always kept in mind that I might need one. Now it could be the time. Not yet, but who knows how things will develop... I have a wife and three kids. They WILL be safe, if not from the disease, from everything else. I raised my DEFCON to 3 right now. I will check the situation in the shops and see if it might be necessary to start stocking up a little. I donít like the idea and will refrain as long as possible, but maybe a few items... Situational awareness will be critical from now on. A tad late, but I admit I thought that would never really happen. I know better now.
    4. Talk to the family. Easy tone, clear words. It is not necessary to get anybody scared, but they need to know that a special and challenging situation is developing. They will be safe, but maybe there will be some different rules to follow within a short time. Kids are great, they can adapt quickly if they understand what is going on. I have mine studying through Internet channels or online systems, living almost the usual way, just a bit more confined, but not agitated or scared.
    5. Iím lucky. I have a well in my yard, pumping up fresh and clean water, so the biggest trouble for a critical time, water, should be averted. But a shortage of water right now would really make me worry. I donít think there is an emergency justifying any panic, but people donít always react correctly, and if panic should break out, my fear is that also all public works, including water supply, might fail. I can live without electricity and gas, but water... That is not a worry to me now, but would have been had I been living anywhere else.
    6. Iím glad I always keep some commercial ammo handy. For my shotgun, for my handguns and for some rifles. Iíll be ok if everything goes south, even though I believe in my reloads, I always wanted to have some commercial ammo just in case. I have it and can be relaxed about this. Iím sure I will never need it...am I?
    7. Iím glad that I live in Italy, so I have bidets in the bathrooms. I wonít need to worry in case of a shortage of toilet paper.

    All of this just because I needed to...say or write down what Iím feeling these days.
    It is so strange, so out of the ordinary...
    Friends of mine in the military Red Cross keep telling me about the tragic situation in the intensive care stations of our hospitals. That this whole situation is not a joke at all. People are dying and the medical personnel are starting to select who they will treat and who they wonít, since there are not enough resources.

    My life is still 90% normal, tomorrow Iíll be in my office, but, since almost two weeks, all the installations, all the maintenance jobs, all Factory Acceptance Tests and also all my trips to customers have been cancelled.
    Other European countries will probably follow on a similar path. I just hope they will receive better information than we did.

    Now that I could vent... I feel better.
    Take care folks.
    Iíll keep posting.
    Maybe that will be helpful for others.

    34a cp., btg. Susa, 3į rgt. Alpini

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  4. #2
    Contributing Member usabaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ovidio View Post
    Now that I could vent... I feel better.
    Thank you for sharing your experience. As the COVAID-19 spreads here in Californa, I can already see people panic buying supplies. I have no doubt that it is going to get worse. An email I received without going in too much detail said that they are executing the pandemic plan and geographic combatant commanders are executing their supporting Pandemic plans iaw. This tell's me there is more to the story than what is being told.

    I was scheduled to go to Sigonella for work, I have told my supervisor I will not go. I believe the meeting will be canceled anyhow. Hope that you are your family remain safe and free from the virus.

    PS: I also have bidets in the bathrooms
    Veteran US Navy Seabees - US Army Corps of Engineers - American Legion Post 0867
    " Only two defining forces have offered to die for me. 1.) Jesus Christ 2.) The American G.I. "One died for your soul, the other for your freedom! "

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    Advisory Panel Surpmil's Avatar
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    Some information that may be useful.

    This should be all over the news internationally given how cheap and effective it is in enclosed spaces, but not much money to made from water droplets. The experts don't mention that once the water droplets that removed the virus particles from the air evaporate, the particles will probably again rise into the air with foot traffic and other disturbance. A good essential oil in the humidifier might help to kill the virus rather than just drop it out of the air. Most essential oils are deadly to micro-organisms. Particularly thymol, oil of oregano, etc. A sage tea made from leaves straight from the bush once cured my child's throat infection in minutes flat...

    For surface disinfection this is an excellent product, said to be as powerful as bleach, but actually consumable, though doing so would wipe out one's flora and fauna. Speaking of which, gut health is said to foundational to immune response.



    The sky is not falling, the mortality is nothing like the "Spanish Flu", and the cytokine storm if any is also nothing like 1918-19. The elderly and the compromised are the primary victims rather than those with the greatest immune response.

    I just heard commentary this evening that infection rates are declining in China and Korea and if we remember SARS, "bird flu" etc. etc., those also petered out.

    High doses of Vit. C and Vit. D are said to be highly effective with most respiratory infections. Most of us are deficient in both. The increasing sunshine levels will help to address the D deficiency except for those of us who never get out in the sun anyway. Vit. D is metabolized by the natural oils on the skin, so they say avoid showering the day before sunbathing for best results.
    Last edited by Surpmil; 03-09-2020 at 12:43 AM.
    "Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened." W.L.S.C..

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  9. #4
    Contributing Member Ovidio's Avatar
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    The situation is getting worse in general. Not here...yet.
    The Police and Military authorities, according to a colleague who is involved, are starting to plan for a possible introduction of the martial law here.
    Still just a theoretical exercise, but they are starting, apparently, to discuss the matter seriously.
    I would be curious to know what is going on elsewhere, like in the red zones.
    Military personnel living outside the red zones (Air Force for sure. I was present when a neighbour of mine received the message) have been told to stay home and not cross the boundary to reach the bases.
    Uprisings in over two dozen jails, with hundreds of criminals on the loose, six dead and many wounded. Police and Army are chasing the fugitives.
    My older son, about to get 17, has started to attend streaming lessons organised by their Latin and Greek professor. Other teachers are gearing up to be able to start teaching from afar.
    He's horribly fed up because he was just starting to date a girl he likes a lot. Now they can't reach each other. I can understand him...
    Austriaicon is checking every car and truck coming from Italyicon. Don't know exactly who they stop and who they don't.
    The good thing is that the work is going well, even in such a crazy time. Lots of mails, telephone or Skype conferences... Today I got a big order from Germanyicon for a machine I have been after for months.
    I thanked that guy and told him that was a real gift. I needed a positive shot and he "administered" it. And we even made a very fair business!
    A few more are starting to get in the decisional phase. Even African customers are showing up again strongly.
    Life still goes on, and normality is just around the corner...
    I confirm DEFCON 3
    34a cp., btg. Susa, 3į rgt. Alpini

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    Contributing Member 30Three's Avatar
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    I hope that get it all under control soon Ovidio. I'm not convinced the figures we are seeing in Franceicon are correct. It's bound to rise a lot before it's finished.
    One thing I have noticed; is the figures and percentages that are being announced on the News channels seem irregular. One say's the death rate is only 1%; but others say that worldwide there are 100,000 cases and over 3,000 deaths, which would be 3%.

    If it gets a proper hold in Paris it will be complicated. But everyone can do their bit to help stop spreading the virus. For example I'm cycling to work instead of taking the metro; it's normally jam packed at 8 in the morning.
    We do have a plan if the situation worsen's here. Just hope we get through it OK.

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    Really Senior Member HOOKED ON HISTORY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ovidio View Post
    Now that I could vent... I feel better.
    Take care folks.
    I’ll keep posting.
    Maybe that will be helpful for others.
    My best to you and yours as well as those under "confinement".
    If this thing is anything like the flu (which I just got over) I would prefer to avoid it.

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    Contributing Member Ovidio's Avatar
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    Italyicon just self-declared itself a red zone.
    Now we’ll start rocking and rolling.
    Got my SPAS12, Stgw58 57 and Garandicon readily available. Unloaded still.
    But with ammo ready.
    Just for the feel of it...
    Here we are used to quakes, floods etc. I’m not overly worried by my landmates. But in other areas...
    We’ll see.
    34a cp., btg. Susa, 3į rgt. Alpini

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    Contributing Member 30Three's Avatar
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    I think the big problems will come when (or if) people start getting hungry. I hope the gouvernment can keep the food chain supplied!
    Take care.

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    If it wasn't for the bloody internet IMHO there would be less panic.
    Yes we need to be informed, and that should be done by TV/Radio and by the experts as you said, not mindless presenters making it sound a lot worse than it is, inflating facts for viewer numbers, with the like of filming of empty shelves of no toilet paper!!.

    Many of us have gone through Ebola/SARS/Avian flu, MERS & Zika with the Military and Police in recent years, so "personal" hygiene is ALWAYS paramount.
    Yesterday in a motorway services toilet 9 out of 10 men NEVER washed their hands, and it will be these individuals who spread all viruses.

    So sad to see Italyicon being hit as bad as it is, I suspect an influx of outsiders isn't helping with border security being relaxed, but its not a blame culture, we as human beings should be all working together to defeat yet another dangerous virus to the old and infirm who don't deserve it.
    This virus MUST be put into context, it will, like all viruses effect those who are already suffering from another serious ailment already, and they are the ones who should be cared for the most.
    Last edited by Gil Boyd; 03-10-2020 at 12:50 PM.
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

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    Then again Gil you have the brainless twits like we had here a 70 y/o got tested she had symtoms but rather than wait and miss her concert she went to it well guess what the tests came back positive and she was in a theatre with a 1000 people a bl**dy minded f*cktard just plain selfish.
    Then we have today 2 english tourists come into my wifes work wanting a medicare card so they can use our health system both of then displaying flu like sysmtoms she coughed and the droplets landed on the girl serving her to which my wife was standing next to they did not even have the common brain power to wear masks its not as if the populace is not informed on controls, now all those in the foyer and my wifes work will have to wait and see!
    I have P-2 masks for us at home for when it gets really bad got enough shite paper as I fortunately brought some before the panic set in, the media needs to calm the populace not get hysteria going we are all going to die if it comes to that I like Ovidio and allot of you have plenty of H power bolt guns & ammo, swords and bayonets plus other goodies I can make that go bang if it gets to the walking dead stage, family before all else..........

    Its simple hygiene wash your hands I have Isoprophyl here as well as detol and antibacterial stuff heck even metho just wash your hands and dont mill up into groups but the lowest denominator is the person whom like the above does not think these are the real issue I think also that the above person was on a plane as well so they are tracking the passengers from that trip to quarantine them as well.

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