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Thread: Help Identifying Type 38

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  1. #11
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
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    If all else fails with the bore, you can "crest" it. Basically, a small amount of "Crest" toothpaste on your bore brush and run it through a few times. THIS DEFINITELY A LAST DITCH TECHNIQUE FOR THE BARREL. Per my FBI sniper instructor, you can seriously harm the barrel if you do it more than once or twice. I have done it to a couple of guns followed by a good copper remover and it will remove a lot of whatever is in there.

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  3. #12
    Member KiloLima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singer B View Post
    If all else fails with the bore, you can "crest" it. Basically, a small amount of "Crest" toothpaste on your bore brush and run it through a few times. THIS DEFINITELY A LAST DITCH TECHNIQUE FOR THE BARREL. Per my FBI sniper instructor, you can seriously harm the barrel if you do it more than once or twice. I have done it to a couple of guns followed by a good copper remover and it will remove a lot of whatever is in there.
    Might give that a go. Going to plug the barrel with a rubber stopper and leave some Hoppe’s #9 in there overnight. See if that helps at all.

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  5. #13
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KiloLima View Post
    Might give that a go. Going to plug the barrel with a rubber stopper and leave some Hoppe’s #9 in there overnight. See if that helps at all.
    Good idea. I would try everything possible first and then if you reach a point where you believe it will only be a wall hangar, then try the "Crest" treatment. I used it on my Remington 700 work rifle and then on a friend's 1903 Springfield and they both came out great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singer B View Post
    If all else fails with the bore, you can "crest" it. Basically, a small amount of "Crest" toothpaste on your bore brush and run it through a few times. THIS DEFINITELY A LAST DITCH TECHNIQUE FOR THE BARREL. Per my FBI sniper instructor, you can seriously harm the barrel if you do it more than once or twice. I have done it to a couple of guns followed by a good copper remover and it will remove a lot of whatever is in there.
    What exactly is in tooth paste that would damage a barrel? If it's that abrasive or caustic it's a wonder people have any teeth left after a week or two.
    I think that FBI sniper instructor was blowing smoke up your asteroid.

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    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vintage hunter View Post
    What exactly is in tooth paste that would damage a barrel? If it's that abrasive or caustic it's a wonder people have any teeth left after a week or two.
    I think that FBI sniper instructor was blowing smoke up your asteroid.
    Older toothpastes were gently abrasive, but more so than a brass brush or cloth patch. I don't think he was blowing smoke since my rifle was able to fire 5-round sub 1-inch groups after he treated it. Since he trained and certified all law enforcement snipers in the western United Statesicon at that time, I'm going to go with his knowledge and expertise on this one.

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    All toothpaste is abrasive, even modern ones. Some more so than others. It is in fact a very very mild polishing compound with flavoring added.
    I still say that instructor was blowing smoke. Did you actually see him put crest toothpaste in your rifles bore straight from the tube?
    And if toothpaste on a bore brush can seriously damage a barrel if done more than once or twice like your instructor says why did you have to then use a copper cleaner afterwards the couple times you used his trick? If TP is abrasive enough to damage steel barrels in short order surely it would remove copper fouling dont ya think?

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    Really Senior Member bob q's Avatar
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    That is one of the silliest things I have heard in a while . So many things in the story deify logic . No one man trained 10's of 1000's of shooters . Most departments have their own training program . Toothpasting bores would have nothing to do with shooting 100 yard sniper rifles . If tooth paste could wipe out steel , nobody would have any teeth left . I work with a lot of abrasives that would remove the enamel from your teeth in short order but will not hurt steel . There are so many good products made for rifle use that work there is no reason at all to use dental products . I also feel someone was having a good laugh at your expense .

  11. #18
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob q View Post
    That is one of the silliest things I have heard in a while . So many things in the story deify logic . No one man trained 10's of 1000's of shooters . Most departments have their own training program . Toothpasting bores would have nothing to do with shooting 100 yard sniper rifles . If tooth paste could wipe out steel , nobody would have any teeth left . I work with a lot of abrasives that would remove the enamel from your teeth in short order but will not hurt steel . There are so many good products made for rifle use that work there is no reason at all to use dental products . I also feel someone was having a good laugh at your expense .
    Obviously you have no experience in certified law enforcement training in California. Special assignments with special skills such as SWAT or traffic collision investigation require certified training approved by the California Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training. The training conducted by most departments on their own is related to practicing and honing those skills learned during the state certified training course which was presented by the FBI at that time. Those training courses (such as sniper training) require a full course outline down to the 3rd level and including sniper tactics, shooting positions, scope use, mental preparation, etc., including care of the rifle. This component is very important since the rifle is responsible for 95% of the success of the shot. Abrasives will remove powder and fouling but won't reach into the rifling grooves to remove copper that's been squeezed into them. Copper fouling always requires chemical removal, thus the plethora of special bore cleaners containing ammonia or similar chemicals intended to dissolve and remove the copper. Police training in California is very heavily regulated and controlled due to the significant liability faced by law enforcement agencies in use of (deadly) force situations. Additionally, since many agencies can't afford their own SWAT teams and snipers, they use regional teams often provided by county sheriff's departments or multi-agency agreements, thus, you don't have "thousands" of snipers, more likely a few hundred. Sniper certification courses are usually offered only once or twice a year since there are so few of them and the turnover is very minimal. I hope this gives you some insight into a special world that very few people get to experience.

  12. #19
    Really Senior Member bob q's Avatar
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    You said the whole western USAicon .

    ---------- Post added at 11:04 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:59 AM ----------

    Texas is in the western USA and it has over 2700 swat trained personal all by itself .


  13. #20
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
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    My apologies reference the misunderstanding. I never said "whole" and in California, everything east of Arizona/Nevada is considered central to eastern United Statesicon. Texas is a wonderful place and I have done some work with agencies there. They are excellent peace officers but have a different training and certification system there. Just as an additional piece of information, in addition to being the lead sniper, our instructor was also the master armorer for the FBI HDT unit. I tend to listen to people with that level of certification and expertise.

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