+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 14

Thread: L1A1 SELF LOADING RIFLE 7.62MM / L12A1 .22 CONVERSION CHALLENGE

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #1
    Moderator
    (Parker Hale Forums)
    Gil Boyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Last On
    Today @ 01:59 PM
    Location
    Home of The Parachute Regiment & 16 Air Assault Brigade
    Posts
    4,300
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM

    L1A1 SELF LOADING RIFLE 7.62MM / L12A1 .22 CONVERSION CHALLENGE

    HISTORY

    John Clark and Gil Boyd, both members of Milsurps and avid L1A1 rifle lovers, set about the particularly vexing challenge of finding a Gunsmith/Engineer in the UK, who could produce a really high quality straight pull L1A1.

    A. that would not start to jam solid after a few rounds.

    B. be as close to the original production rifle as the UK law would allow.

    While there have been other builders of Straight Pull L1A1’s, the quality of the builds varied massively, from functioning ‘as required’ to being really fussy regarding ammunition.

    The second part (and Holy Grail) was to fabricate a new .22 Semi-Automatic Conversion kit, along the lines of the original Heckler & Koch L12A1 kit, issued to the Britishicon and Commonwealth forces and in a slightly modified form, to users of the Metric Fal.

    This kit, consisting of blow back bolt group, bore liner with integral chamber insert and specially adapted magazines, allows the 7.62 x 51mm rifle to operate in .22LR Semi-Automatic.

    All of this during the world’s COVID pandemic of 2020/2021.

    We turned to master engineer Peter Sarony of Armalon Ltd, on the former RAF Bampton Castle site in Oxfordshire, and laid down the gauntlet, which he ably accepted!

    This long held ‘back burner’ project was brought about primarily by the lack of conversion units in the UK and the rest of the world that would utilise the strict parameters of the 7.62mm L1A1 rifled barrel.

    As stated, H&K had previously produced .22 conversion units for the Ministry of Defence, but they had all since disappeared over time and very few were left in circulation, those that were out there, were either shot out with damaged and missing parts, or simply kept in private hands. Picture of the H&K kit shown below.

    The very few complete original L12A1 kits that come onto the market sell for prices that have more Zeros than Pearl Harbour!

    With a .22 liner sample supplied to Peter via John and an original bolt group supplied by Gil, Peter set about designing and building a brand new .22 conversion kit for those out there who wanted to simply drop it into their L1A1 for a more sedate (and far cheaper) shooting experience!

    It had to be reliable, as we all know, "reliability and semi-automatic" don’t necessarily come hand in hand regarding .22LR.

    It had to be able to be readily swapped out by the operator at the shooting range, without special tools.

    Anyone who has tried placing an original L12A1 .22 liner into an original L1A1 barrel will be well reminded of the old “throwing a sausage down the high Street” adage, as it clanks its way down the barrel with enough spare room to drive a London bus alongside it!

    With the above in mind, Peter studied the original set up and made adjustments to the materials and construction. In qualitative terms, Peter’s conversion kits are miles ahead.
    I am certainly not knocking the original H&K units, these were always reliable units, but mass produced, with a design suitable for mass production.

    Peter makes the barrels for his L1A1’s on the original Parker Hale plant that produced the last FTR and rebarrelling for the MoD’s L1A1s. They are identical to the original production barrels and having inspected them in ‘the white’, they are of the extremely high quality you would expect from Armalon.

    The Barrel liners for Peter’s conversion kits are individually adjusted to the bore of the designated rifle, this ensures a snug liner to bore fit, that keeps the liner firmly supported by the concentric rifling and eliminates the old bulging issues caused by a loose fit … but also caused by service, heavy handed misuse in days gone by!

    It’s probably a good time to tell you that Armalon bought most of the fine machinery used by Parker Hale for decades in producing its firearms, and the cream of this machinery together with Armalon’s CNC Machining centres, was used to produce the finished conversion unit and liner for this specific task. Top Left Photo.


    Just two standard lathes in a workshop full of sheer quality machinery

    I wanted an L1A1 straight pull (legal requirement in the UK) under current Firearms Law, that did not jam up after a number of rounds and fail to eject, but I also wanted the added facility of a .22 liner and action that could simply be slid into the L1A1 barrel on a quick and simple conversion from 7.62mm to .22.

    The rounds used throughout were GGG 7.62mm rounds and any full power .22 Rim fire, but ELEY were used for the trials. GGG were found to be the most tolerant and suitable for the task, with no jamming experienced or ejection problems.

    Peter and his engineer, spent a lot of time honing the action and barrel to ensure the GGG worked 100% efficiently, but also the ejection claws of both full and small bore actions were finely tuned to achieve the aim of producing a reliable solution to this age old problem.



    Newly hammer forged barrels banks await for their new homes

    With an L1A1 parts kit purchased from Helston Gunsmiths Ltd, the challenge was set. Peter set about sorting out all the tolerances of the parts required, and also manufacturing, brand new parts that were different to those made by leading manufacturers in the past. Second article show photos of new manufactured parts built by Armalon and existing H&K actions as a comparison.

    CNC machines were tasked with producing the core of the .22 actions and all the ancillaries that go with that, to a new and higher standard, including a new magazine. All were produced in the best metals and produced to a very high standard.


    The .22 block and follower machined to the highest standard

    ASSEMBLY

    After a gruelling year of business lockdowns and disruptions during the COVID pandemic of 2020/2021 and the work being carried out, the challenge began to come together, and finely manufactured parts started to emerge from the Armalon factory.

    The following picture shows the comparison H&K .22 parts used by the British Army and other countries in the 1970’s known as ‘Conversion kit 7.62 Millimetre rifle .22 Inch Calibre(L12A1) NSN 1005-21-864-5568’ in its wooden chest, supplied with two magazines. The barrel liner can be seen above the magazines and the NSN label and the working parts at the lower quadrant of the chest. This was the most common .22 conversion solution using the L1A1 rifle at the time.


    H&K .22 parts used by the British Army and other countries in the 1970’s known as ‘Conversion kit 7.62 Millimetre rifle .22 Inch Calibre(L12A1) NSN 1005-21-864-5568’


    The .22 HK conversion unit and liner fitted into Johns L1A1 rifle with the top cover removed.


    The .22 HK liner entering the L1A1 barrel.


    The HK .22 working parts in the rifle without the top cover


    The top image shows the H&K conversion unit and the Armalon (partially assembled) conversion unit below


    Image shows the new Armalon .22 magazine insert and outer casing less spring, with the barrel liner shown below


    Showing all the parts that make up the new Armalon .22 conversion for the L1A1 rifle on the right which will be sold as a kit


    Clearly, Peter Sarony and Armalon, wanted to build something new and refreshing and that is what they certainly achieved.

    The quality is exceptional, the conversion kit allows rifle flexibility, providing a finely tuned kit which could be used in any existing L1A1 7.62mm barrelled rifle (liner made to the dimensions required) or built to order, as a rifle and conversion kit, paired engineering perfection!

    The challenge was to also keep the overall cost at an acceptable level, and this has been achieved at £1500 including VAT to the buyer all proof tested and marked accordingly. All parts provided will also be housed in a protective case.

    To secure your order contact Peter Sarony personally at:

    peter.sarony@armalon.com
    Telephone for enquiries 020 7262 1881
    Armalon Limited, Unit 3 Bampton Business Centre North, Weald, Oxon, OX18 2ET. (01993)852788

    Gil and John
    Last edited by Badger; 05-05-2021 at 11:30 AM.
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

  2. The Following 4 Members Say Thank You to Gil Boyd For This Useful Post:


  3. # ADS
    Friends and Sponsors
    Join Date
    October 2006
    Location
    Milsurps.Com
    Posts
    All Threads
    Banner AD Space Available - Click HERE to Inquire LIMITED TIME OFFER FROM THE AMERICAN GUNSMITHING INSTITUTE: Get Immediate Online Access To AGI's NEW Armorer's Course for Glock Pistols, Covering Every Generation of Glocks, Including the Latest Model 42/43 and Double Stack Pistols for ONLY $7.00! Brian Dick ... BDL Ltd. - Specializing in British and Commonwealth weapons Chuck in Denver ... Buy-Sell-Trade .. Guns, Cars Motorcycles Your source for the finest in High Power Competition Gear. Here at T-bones Shipwrighting we specialise in vintage service rifle: re-barrelling, bedding, repairs, modifications and accurizing. We also provide importation services for firearms, parts and weapons, for both private or commercial businesses.
     

  4. #2
    Contributing Member mrclark303's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Last On
    Today @ 02:14 PM
    Location
    The wild west of England
    Posts
    2,949
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM
    Real Name
    Mr Clark
    Just to add, there will be updates and new pictures as the first batch are completed...
    .303, helping Englishmen express their feelings since 1889

  5. Thank You to mrclark303 For This Useful Post:


  6. Avoid Ads - Become a Contributing Member - Click HERE
  7. #3
    Moderator
    (Parker Hale Forums)
    Gil Boyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Last On
    Today @ 01:59 PM
    Location
    Home of The Parachute Regiment & 16 Air Assault Brigade
    Posts
    4,300
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM
    Thread Starter
    Keeping the old girl snug and warm on route to the range AGAIN!!
    Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	L1A1 SLR IN CASE 1-5-2021.jpg‎
Views:	52
Size:	81.8 KB
ID:	117078  
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

  8. Thank You to Gil Boyd For This Useful Post:


  9. #4
    Really Senior Member Roy W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 03:51 PM
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    431
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    01:41 PM
    Do the new kits work with original magazines?

    Would the new barrel liner work with an original breech block?
    Or are they a unique kit?

    Thanks

  10. #5
    Contributing Member mrclark303's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Last On
    Today @ 02:14 PM
    Location
    The wild west of England
    Posts
    2,949
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM
    Real Name
    Mr Clark
    Quote Originally Posted by Roy W View Post
    Do the new kits work with original magazines?

    Would the new barrel liner work with an original breech block?
    Or are they a unique kit?

    Thanks
    The short answer is yes Roy, though all component parts are changed and modified from the original, (in qualitive terms, they are streets ahead) each element will work with original component parts.

  11. #6
    Moderator
    (Parker Hale Forums)
    Gil Boyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Last On
    Today @ 01:59 PM
    Location
    Home of The Parachute Regiment & 16 Air Assault Brigade
    Posts
    4,300
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM
    Thread Starter
    Roy,



    The good news is, and something on John and my wishlist was that...............they work and cross match to any H&K pieces as well as the old magazines. As you can see from the images the magazine disassembled. This one part to be re designed and manufactured took a great deal of time to ensure it fitted absolutely correctly and work with previous kits.
    So in short you could just buy a magazine from Peter, and he would stand by its reliablility.
    Next week I will put a bit of video up.
    I fired 50 x ELEY .22 rounds as I had run out of CCI MiniMags, it proved even at low power it through the working parts back well. Fired 50 rounds with only two ejected, that had been struck.
    I then removed the Armalon/H&K parts and fired 50 x GGG 7.62 rounds with no stoppages whatsoever on straight pull.
    So many people disbelieved me, I decided to show a video next week............wait out!!
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

  12. #7
    Really Senior Member Roy W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 03:51 PM
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    431
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    01:41 PM
    That's good then, shame they are so expensive though

  13. #8
    Moderator
    (Parker Hale Forums)
    Gil Boyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Last On
    Today @ 01:59 PM
    Location
    Home of The Parachute Regiment & 16 Air Assault Brigade
    Posts
    4,300
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM
    Thread Starter
    Roy,
    Sadly the procedures that Peter adopted to change the design to his own, and thereafter manufacture them during COVID19 took its toll. The price in my humble opinion knowing the detailed work that they have committed to this project is a fair one. The new magazines alone cost a fortune with new inerds and a more reliable system employed to achieve continued fire in semi auto.
    He has 8 firm orders already, out of the 11 he produced on the first traunch
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

  14. Thank You to Gil Boyd For This Useful Post:


  15. #9
    Really Senior Member Roy W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 03:51 PM
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    431
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    01:41 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Gil Boyd View Post
    Roy,
    Sadly the procedures that Peter adopted to change the design to his own, and thereafter manufacture them during COVID19 took its toll. The price in my humble opinion knowing the detailed work that they have committed to this project is a fair one. The new magazines alone cost a fortune with new inerds and a more reliable system employed to achieve continued fire in semi auto.
    He has 8 firm orders already, out of the 11 he produced on the first traunch
    Gil,
    I don't doubt the work that went into them and if that's what he needs to charge to recoup costs, then that's fair.

    It still remains a lot of money for a .22 conversion kit.

    I am glad he is selling them.

  16. #10
    Contributing Member mrclark303's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Last On
    Today @ 02:14 PM
    Location
    The wild west of England
    Posts
    2,949
    Local Date
    06-15-2021
    Local Time
    07:41 PM
    Real Name
    Mr Clark
    Quote Originally Posted by Roy W View Post
    Gil,
    I don't doubt the work that went into them and if that's what he needs to charge to recoup costs, then that's fair.

    It still remains a lot of money for a .22 conversion kit.

    I am glad he is selling them.
    First batch almost gone Roy .....

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. L12A1 22 conversion unit for FN FAL
    By JamesB in forum WTS/WTB/WTT (Want to Sell, Buy or Trade) Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-17-2017, 05:24 PM
  2. L12A1 .22 Kit for the L1A1 rifle
    By Buccaneer in forum FNFAL Rifles
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 08-22-2016, 11:36 AM
  3. L1A1 re loading
    By CCAMERA50 in forum FNFAL Rifles
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-13-2011, 10:14 AM
  4. Making The Ruger 10/22 Team Challenge Conversion
    By Newsfeed Hound in forum The Watering Hole OT (Off Topic) Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 06-24-2010, 10:50 AM
  5. Making The Ruger 10/22 Team Challenge Conversion
    By Newsfeed Hound in forum The Watering Hole OT (Off Topic) Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 06-23-2010, 05:20 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts