Interesting bullet cross section

[RJW NZ]

Just found one of my old photos of a bullet I cut in half; its interesting to see just how much aluminum is at the front of the bullet and holding the lead very much to the rear and making that rearward center of gravity the ol 303 is known for.

The other standout feature is the varying wall thickness on each side of the lead, no wonder there's all sorts of discussion about varying quality of war time ammo, and the corkscrew flight this feature will cause when the rifling gets it going at 174,000 rpm.

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[paulseamus]

RJW

Very interesting. Perhaps during a war quantity is sometimes more important that quality.

What is the age of the cut projectile? Is it WW1 or WW2?

Have you compared with a modern projectile such as a Sierra Match 174g?

If not let me know and i will get the hacksaw out.

Paul

[RJW NZ]

What is the age of the cut projectile? Is it WW1 or WW2?

Have you compared with a modern projectile such as a Sierra Match 174g?

Hi Paul, the ammo was ww2 brit, and no I haven't compared many at all. I did have one which had something like compressed cotton in the tip where the aluminum is on this one. The other ww2 bullet I wanted to open but don't currently have are the ones that appear to have a 1/16th or less hole in the tip. It might be formed if the copper jacket is rolled somehow or it may be something which has a function, as creepy as those implications might be, such as increased wounding capacity.
That varying jacket thickness is kind of stunning. I have a whole dissertion here by someone discussing that exact thing and the repercussions on accuracy, but with the caveat that 'this kind of thing is rarely seen', lol, except in the very first one I open.

If you're going to go along I'll find a couple more to pen up as well. I got about a dozen different profiles, wartime and civilian use, we could look at.

[hopmanhenk]

this is a picture I made of some sixties surplus bullets (AI marked, dutch)


left is copper clad steel
center is copper
right is whitish clad copper

[TonyE]

I think you will find that the side of the envelope that appears thickest is the side that you started cutting and the hacksaw blade has dragged some of the softer copper envelope into the lead. If you polished the cut I think you would find the variance in envelope thickness would disappear. I have sectioned many .303 bullets of all types and even wartime production is not that bad.

The Mark VII bulets with the "cotton" material in the tip is a wartime economy that used compressed wood fibre to save aluminium. Other materials that have been used as a tip filler over the years are ceramic, compressed paper and plastic. U.S. contract production of .303 ball ammunition for Britain did not have the lighter tip filler and so the bullets are slightly shorter than the regular Mark VII.

Your other point is about WW2 hollow point bullets. There were none in WW2. Are you thinking of the Mark IV and V round nosed hollow point bullets which date from the late 1890s? These were banned by the St.Peterberg Convention and were relegated to training after 1899, although some were issued in 1905 for an expedition to Somaliland. There is no aluminium tip in those and the hole is punched into the bullet about .3 inches deep, the piece of envelope cut out being carried to the base of the hole.

The WW2 early production .303 Incendiary B Mark VIz bullet had a very small hole (less than 1mm) in the nose that was filled with solder, but it is virtually invisible unless one is looking for it, so I doubt if you mean that.

Regards
TonyE

[terryinvictoria]

I think you will find that the side of the envelope that appears thickest is the side that you started cutting and the hacksaw blade has dragged some of the softer copper envelope into the lead. If you polished the cut I think you would find the variance in envelope thickness would disappear. I have sectioned many .303 bullets of all types and even wartime production is not that bad.

The Mark VII bulets with the "cotton" material in the tip is a wartime economy that used compressed wood fibre to save aluminium. Other materials that have been used as a tip filler over the years are ceramic, compressed paper and plastic. U.S. contract production of .303 ball ammunition for Britain did not have the lighter tip filler and so the bullets are slightly shorter than the regular Mark VII.

Your other point is about WW2 hollow point bullets. There were none in WW2. Are you thinking of the Mark IV and V round nosed hollow point bullets which date from the late 1890s? These were banned by the St.Peterberg Convention and were relegated to training after 1899, although some were issued in 1905 for an expedition to Somaliland. There is no aluminium tip in those and the hole is punched into the bullet about .3 inches deep, the piece of envelope cut out being carried to the base of the hole.

The WW2 early production .303 Incendiary B Mark VIz bullet had a very small hole (less than 1mm) in the nose that was filled with solder, but it is virtually invisible unless one is looking for it, so I doubt if you mean that.

Regards
TonyE

The bullets pictures I posted years ago with the 1/16th hollow point at the tip were post world war two modifications of military ammunition and are considered not safe to shoot.

This is due to the fact that the bullets are FMJ type and when modified are open at both ends.

With the modification of the bullet to hollow point it is considered to be an unsafe cartridge -shoot at your own risk.

There were reports of the lead core extruding itself out the open tip, to be more exact I would imagine in some cases the bullet jacket tip ( hollow point) breached allowing the core to exit the barrel leaving the jacket in the bore.

You can imagine the results on the next shot.

It was a fairly common experience after world war two to find these modified bullet/cartridges . They were cheap compared to new factory soft points. With jobs scarce and hunting very popular in the rural aeeas of America and Canada this ammunition was affordable for Men wanting to put meat on the table.

I cannot seem to upload a picture to my account to post a picture today.

Regards
Terry in Victoria

[Rowdy]

Would these be modified? - not the Mk. IV and V shown alongside.

[RobD]

Hi Tony
hollow point .303 were used in a limited way in the early engagements of the Boer War (British troops), and extensively in the Bambata Rebellion of 1906 (South African troops).
Rob

[villiers]

Could the "corkscrew effect" (mentioned above) be the reason why my No 5 shoots better at 300 metres than at 100?

[RJW NZ]

Could the "corkscrew effect" (mentioned above) be the reason why my No 5 shoots better at 300 metres than at 100?

thank you, lol, I once got in trouble for suggesting such a thing. I have some text on this, I'll see what I can locate.