No 4 Mk1 T Transit box Reproductions/Canadian Version

[grant580]

I goggled "scamic" today and it turns out that scamic is a particular paint tone/colour. It's proper nomenclature is "060 scamic green, shade 314 Indian Army" according to one website. I thought it was that "purplish/reddish colour paint we see on some transit boxes, both bren and Enfield.

[Peter Laidler]

Are you a chippy Grant? That's another REME technical term for anyone who deals with wood..... from a bodgy builder to a highly skilled cabinet maker! The woodwork is certainly good. Are they exact copies, down to the dovetailed ends etc etc? Do you have a dovetailing machine?

A 'tinny' is either a can of drink or anyone who deals in metalwork. From the roughest welder with an over amp'ed arc welder to the highest skilled machinist!

[tbonesmith]

I was planning on building one/some myself, and was wondering , on the originals were the dovetails hand cut or done on a router jig? I have some router dovetailing jigs, but if they were hand cut originally, that's possible too.

[Peter Laidler]

I would imagine that as they were produced at a factory, most at REMPLOY at Papworth in Cambridge or Elliots in Pembroke Steet in Newbury, that they'd be machine cut

I used to know a fellow who worked at Elliots as a young lad in nthe war, assembling Horsa glider fuselages. He remembers the Bren boxes but they were all semi-assembled, ready to be fully assembled elsewhere. By semi assembled, the sides were finished with all the internals screwed in place. All the final assemblers had to do was fix the sides and ends together and screw the base on.

I suppose that it's reasonable to expect that this is what happened to the No4T chests. He remembers the Bren chests because those are the ones he saw during his national service......., that were so bloody heavy!

[FlightRN]

Greetings All,
When I had the Lithgow No1 MkIII HT reproduction case made, the builder went through a supplier of stencils to those that were restoring military vehicles and they turned out well. I still have them stored in the US if anyone wants them but it will be quite awhile (a year?) before I can put my hands on them. I can't remember why we chose the internal color (red) we did except that he had some research to support it.





Have a great day,
Michael

[grant580]

Are you a chippy Grant? That's another REME technical term for anyone who deals with wood..... from a bodgy builder to a highly skilled cabinet maker! The woodwork is certainly good. Are they exact copies, down to the dovetailed ends etc etc? Do you have a dovetailing machine?

A 'tinny' is either a can of drink or anyone who deals in metalwork. From the roughest welder with an over amp'ed arc welder to the highest skilled machinist!

Well, I guess I am a "chippy" Peter!, not sure if I rate as a highly skilled cabinet maker yet, but just a "box builder" Thank you for your compliment, I appreciate it.
I am doing my best to build them as close to the originals as possible and my "model" has always been the Canadian sniper transit box in the excellent 160 page photo essay posted by Badger some time ago on milsurp.com. I have a supply of approximately 21 sets of Canadian four screw hinge/hasp sets that I aquired from a fellow Canadian gun nut who has salvaged a bunch from some No 7 boxes. I do have a copy of the blueprints that were circulating on the net that I have been using, but suspect they are of British origin, which of course are very close to the Canadian boxes.
Because I build them to sell I have chose to build them with only with 3/8 inch finger joints on the corners for now because I am not sure if people would be willing to pay the extra $$ for the dovetails, as they are more labour intensive. I do not have a dovetail jig as of yet, but plan on buying one soon with all the attachments and then I can start doing the dovetails.

I think one of my biggest issues right now is trying to find a colour match for the interior of the Canadian version boxes. The Canadian boxes I have seen seem to have the more "purplish/reddish" colour and the British boxes seem to be more of a reddish colour on the inside.

[grant580]

I was planning on building one/some myself, and was wondering , on the originals were the dovetails hand cut or done on a router jig? I have some router dovetailing jigs, but if they were hand cut originally, that's possible too.

Hello tbonesmith

I would assume that the dovetails were cut by machine, but also read somewhere that in some of the factories that produced them that they were hand cut and took about 3 hours per box. Not sure if this would be true about hand cutting them, but it could be because back then I doubt if they had the fancy router jigs and stuff hey do now-adays. It would be interesting to find out about that, perhaps someone will reply about it?
A dovetail is not really as hard to do as most people think, you just need a good set of chisels, backsaw and a dovetail marking jig, all of which you can aquire from an outfit here in Canada called Lee Valley Tools. They are accessible online and they are awesome to deal with and only sell the best tools known to man. It would be closer to the originals if you could do the dovetails for sure. There was a fellow sometime ago on Canadian gun nutz who built a box out of maple and used dovetails, should check that out, he did an awesome job.
I do simple 3/8 inch finger joints on mine which is quick and easy and the 3/8 inch spacing works evenly into the height diamensions of the box.

If there is anyway I can help you with your box, let me know and I can also get you a set of original hardware and leather handles, stencils made up etc,,

grant580

[tbonesmith]

Thanks very much. I'll keep watching this thread with interest.
Also it looks a beautiful job you've done with yours thus far.
I am a shipwright/boatbuilder by trade, and have been working as a cabinetmaker for the past few years, and recently did some tool boxes very similar in construction method and size to these, and even with jig cut dovetails I can appreciate the time and effort you must have gone to, to finish your previous boxes to the standard it appears you have.
Cheers for the photos and the info.
All the best with your great repro's.

[grant580]

Thanks very much. I'll keep watching this thread with interest.
Also it looks a beautiful job you've done with yours thus far.
I am a shipwright/boatbuilder by trade, and have been working as a cabinetmaker for the past few years, and recently did some tool boxes very similar in construction method and size to these, and even with jig cut dovetails I can appreciate the time and effort you must have gone to, to finish your previous boxes to the standard it appears you have.
Cheers for the photos and the info.
All the best with your great repro's.

Thank you for the compliments tbonesmith. Have you tried to build a sniper transit box yet?
Took a few pictures of a box I have on the go that I varnished the interior clear. Once the interior dries I lightly steel wool it and then wax it with good furniture wax that comes from the UK. Still have the stencils to go on it, which is often the hard part because you have to let the paint cure a long time or else the green pulls off with the stencils I use.
I have also included a picture of a set of hardware as they look when I start out with them, all the leather, screws and a set of stencils that I use on my boxes. The hinges have four screws which means they are Canadian.





The last picture shows the detail of the hasp being held in place with a brass rivet and you can see the C broad arrow stamp I put on the lid. I had this C broad arrow stamp made up by a Croatian Master Engraver out West. You can also see that about the last two inches of the lid has a "T" shaped joint in it that holds a piece of wood measuring 2 inches by 5 inches with the grain going the other way to prevent warping.

[Peter Laidler]

Just a minor point, but shouldn't the round base of the staple be recessed?