1942 NZ-marked Long Branch No.4 Mk.1* - finally mine!!!

[Brian Dick]

I've had a few marked as pictured above. My very first Long Branch No.4, a 1943 rifle is also marked but with the electric pencil. I've no doubt it's correct as done in New Zealand. I bought it from a shop I worked for in Florida as a kid and I still have it.

[Chris7171]

Hi again
If a rifle came up here with an electro pencilled NZ mark, I can safely say that it would be treated with suspicion you just don’t see them here. My question is that if the armourer went to the trouble to “stamp” the NZ number on the butt socket and bolt then why did he not stamp N^Z on it?

I have been in contact in the past with the national NZ army museum; the No4 was never used by NZ army during WW2 (except No4 T) only the SMLE’s was used, I have inspected some of their No4’s all stamped N^Z.
New Zealand was one of the few countries that was owed money after the war as we supplied food, wool, flax, wood etc, all No4 &No5’s were supplied in payment and to make up for war losses, we got thousands more than we ever needed (that is why Peter found unopened crates of them). I guess that when these rifles were all sold off, we in NZ got all the old “used” rifles and any new rifles were sold overseas, that is when I think the electro pencilled mark turns up. I have a suspicion that the electro pencil mark is a later addition when sold, funning that they seem to only turn up in the states.
Chris
Ps. The stamped N^Z mark is on just about all NZ issued rifles SMLE, Metfords, and I have even seen it on a Martini carbine but never the other.

[Brian Dick]

I've got a couple of black plastic oilers with the NZ marking on the cap. They're priced at $5 each.

[Peter Laidler]

As a bit of an aside, when I was an Armourer there, I put the NZ census mark on a load of L2 rifles for a unit at Papakura. The NZ numbers were in addition to the AD/Lithgow number and were allocated from a place at Trentham via the main Ordnance depot at Sylvia Park. The rifles were crap and soon got back loaded for lack of a) spares b) enthusiasm for them and c) lack of intrerest in them. I just stamped them but in NZ, as well as the normal stamps and electric pencil (known to us in the LAD workshops as the fuzzy pen.....) we also had a hand held vibrating chisel type of tool that you could use to chisel out the number etc. It was quite a ferocious machine and if you didn't hold it tight and support your hand, it'd just chomp out divets of metal leaving a mess. Being a pom I just stuck to what I knew - the number stamps! And left the vibro-cutter to Jock Annandale who was also a pom, but a Jock pom if that makes any sense! Jock was also a friend of the late KimW from this forum. Small world..............

Jock Annandale was VERY good with the vibro cutter to the extent that he 'engraved' my name on the back of my Omega watch with it which I still have somewhere. I've never seen one of the hand held vibrators since.......... well, I have but not with a chisel at the front!

[Brian Dick]

I just got my 1943 LB out to refresh my memory. It's stamped on the butt socket above the LB serial number with the N^Z and the 38408 NZ number. It's engraved on the top of the receiver ring with an electric pencil NZ over 38408. It's the only I remember seeing with the electric pencil marking on the top of the receiver. it's original and unaltered, has some character too unlike some of the newish rifles i've had that were NZ marked. I had changed out the original LB Mk.2 flip sight for a British Mk.1 as a kid but have since changed it back to "as issued" with the Mk.2 sight. It shoots like a dream too. Hey, I ought to put one of these oil bottles in it!!

[Peter Laidler]

When I was in NZ, the Armourers had heard of the Mk1/2 and 1/3 rifles from the EMER's and parts lists but hadn't seen one in the flesh so I got the drawings and a defective Mk1/2 body sent over from the main 40 Base Workshops in Singapore. I've still got a set of the DDE drawings that I kept for myself

[spinecracker]

Jock was also a friend of the late KimW from this forum. Small world..............

It was KimW's prior post on the parallax forum that I referenced earlier regarding the electropenciling, and it sounded like he had first or second hand experience regarding the electropenciling of No.4s at a NZREME workshop level. I am sure that Mr. Laidler can fill in the details on someone who sounded like an interesting person. So really the question is this - was the electropenciling done when the rifles were received and/or when they were sold? I will try and dig deeper.

[Peter Laidler]

I am sure that they were done once they were in service. I can't say about the No4's (and we had some No5's too) of course as they all seemed to be marked but the L2's that I did were already in service. I did a load of L2A3 Sterling SMG's too that were issued to replace the old Mk2 Sten guns that we had. My boss had gone to Bordon in England to do the technical course on the Sterlings and as I'd already been trained on them, together we taught the other regular and CMF/TF Armourers the inns and out of them - including one Bruce Gorton than many of you Kiwis will remember

I remember one RNZAF Armourer who knew the complicated .303" Brownings inside out and upside down to the Nth detail but he just couldn't quite grasp the trigger mechanism of the Sterling. I suggested cutting a trigger mech open to skeletonise it but Jock said that we didn't have enough of the expensive spares to waste doing that........... I went back a few months later and left a huge bagfull of L2A3 spares on his desk plus Bren locking shoulder screws that I seem to recall were always in short supply!