Gew 88/05 "S" Marked Barrel Specifics?

[jmoore]

A minimum charge almost always backs out primers for me. I thinkall you need to do is step up the charge weight and the primer drama will go away. Accuracy doesn't look too bad at pistol distance, so stretch it out a bit!

You are correct as regards the bore. Lots of conflicting info out there! As you have measured, the bore is original, just the lead is longer. Which doesn't help accuracy, but doesn't destroy it for military purposes..

Information

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[Patrick Chadwick]

just the lead is longer.

... which is why these rifles will perform better with the long 200 gn bullets than with lighter weights. And flat-base will be better than boat-tail. Both the factors help to get the bullet down the lead as far as possible before the back end of the bullet leaves the neck of the case. Yes, I know that the case will expand before the bullet gets moving, but a cylindrical back end in the expanded neck is still a lot better centered than a boattail flapping about in that long lead with hot gases washing all around it.

Patrick

[Patrick Chadwick]

As several queries have involved this matter, here is the real story.

1) With the Gew.88, the Germans introduced the 8x57I cartridge, the I standing for Infantry. In German literature you may find 8x57J. Don't worry, it's the same thing, but the Germans often used a capital J instead of I in print, to avoid confusion with the number 1.

2) It was discovered that the bullet was too small for the bore. Gas blowby led to rapid barrel wear.

3) The military therefore increased the bullet diameter when they introduced the Spitzer bullet (hence the S). This was a better fit in the bore, and resulted in both improved barrel life and improved accuracy. Note that the bullet was changed, to suit the barrel - not the other way around. The land/groove dimensions were not altered. But the neck end of the chamber + lead had to be reamed out to accept the larger bullet.

All military rifles thus altered were marked with an S (for Spitzer) and the chambering/cartridge was renamed to 8x57IS (or 8x67JS). As the offical date of this change was 1905, the Gew.88 rifles thus marked are known as Gew.88/05.

4) While the military was painfully facing up to the need for change, civilian gunmakers had long implemented their own solution - which was to change the barrel to suit the bullet!
So the bore dimensions (land/groove diameters) were reduced, enabling civilians to continue using the original bullets and cases (which must have been cheaply available by the million when the 8x57I was phased out by the military). It took nearly forty years until this chambering was officially recognized and standardized as 8x57I in 1939.

When wondering what ammo is right for your 8x57 is it therefore vital to distinguish between military and civilian rifles.

Military
Gew.88 with the S mark (i.e. Gew. 88/05)
- this has the standard 8x57IS chambering. No problem with cartridge dimensions. But please remember (as always) that the words "full load" and "century-old rifle" do not go well together.
If you came across some 8x57I ammo and fired it in these rifles - no problem, but probably poor performance (and throat erosion).

Gew.88 without the S
If you find one of these, do NOT try and feed it with 8x57IS ammo. If the cartridge can be chambered at all, the cartridge neck will be a jam fit in the chamber, and will therefore produce serious overpressure when fired. In this case, you must use 8x57I ammo.

Civilian
The civilian picture is totally unsure. The late introduction of the standarization distinction between 8x57I and 8x57IS, plus the fact that there are plenty of civilian rifles around that have been converted from military rifles, means that the ONLY safe thing to do with a civilian 8x57 is to measure the chamber before firing anything! (It's always a good idea for any rifle, regardless of what may be stamped on it!)

Patrick