GEW 88 Enigma

[Patrick Chadwick]

I think Claven2 has got it nearly right.

But

First thought would be caliber change to a rimmed cartridge.

is, I think, the correct answer.

1) Dings on wood but none on metal = metal has been refinished. I am quite sure about this, as I have such a rifle in my possession!

2) Shoulders have been ground off the bolt = chambering alteration, at the very least to a rimmed cartridge. But not .303 - the bore would be far too loose, and it looks as if it is an original German barrel, if not necessarily the original barrel.

The simplest explanation is that it may have been modified for 8x57 IR - the rimmed version of the 8x57 I used for break-top hunting rifles. Please note I not IS - in other words the original Gew.88 bore/groove dimensions. So .323 bullets would be too fat - you need the .318 diameter.
Dimensions and load info for the 8x57IR can be found in the Dynamit Nobel Wiederladen - the "blue book".

Simple test: see if an 8x57 case can be chambered. If so, QED*. Well, almost, but please note that there is also an 8x57 IRS - the rimmed version of the later 8x57IS.

Safety note 1
In this case, you MUST slug the bore.
Bore/groove 7.80 / 8.07 mm = original "I" bore
Bore / groove 7,92 / 8,20 = "IS" bore

Safety note 2
The rimmed versions of 8x57 I and 8x57 IS have much a lower Pmax than the rimless versions.
857 I - 3800 bar
8x57 IR - 3200 bar
8x57IS - 3900 bar
8x57 IRS - 3300 bar

So please do NOT try any K98 loads in this old action! Before someone writes in to point out that the rifle was originally made for the 3800 bar of the 8x57 I: yes, I have worked that out myself, but the reworking of the bolt means that the weak point is likely to be the base of the cartridge.


Patrick

*8x57 cases are too wide at the shoulder to fit into a .303 chamber. And a touch too long. But with worn military chambers one is never quite sure, and I have seen a 308 pushed into a 30-06 chamber - which should also be impossible. So Claven2's recommendation to make a chamber cast is sound advice.

Information

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[Buccaneer]

) Dings on wood but none on metal = metal has been refinished. I am quite sure about this, as I have such a rifle in my possession!

Many thanks for the advice Patrick it will be acted on. You say you have a similar rifle in your possession does the action have an arsenal mark or is it blank like mine? I really would love to find out where this rifle was built and the reason if any why it is unmarked. Did any of the arsenal's produce unmarked rifles?

[Patrick Chadwick]

You say you have a similar rifle in your possession does the action have an arsenal mark or is it blank like mine?

Two similar/relevant cases, but not the same.

Case 1) Schultz & Larsen M69 match rifle. Heavy 6.5x55 S&L barrel on an original Gew.98 action. No. 39xx with no series letter. I.e. first series of that year. All parts matching. Even the follower has a Prussian proof mark and the last two figures of the number. Refinished (parkerized) by S&L. All number, stamps etc clear, as on the Gew88. But no trace of the original crest/arsenal mark+date on the barrel ring. So, if done professionally, it is possible to refinish a rifle so that you cannot see any traces of the origin marks. Like the Gew.88 in this thread.

Case 2) M1896 Swedish Mauser / Carl Gustaf production, also in 6,5x55. Dinged wood, but professional refinishing of the metal. The giveaway (as in the case of the Gew.88) is the discrepancy between the wear/scratches etc on the wood and the metal.

I do not think that arsenals, like Amberg or Danzig, produced "unlabelled" actions. Arsenal rifles were part of military procurement, and apart from possible "lunchbox specials", were marked accordingly. But Mauser itself certainly did produce commercial actions for hunting rifles. In the case of the Gew.88 in this thread, I still thinky that it was a normal military rifle that was simply converted to a rimmed case for use by a hunter, and the simplest conversion would have been to the 8x57 IR. Although, as jmoore points out, other chambering are conceivable. We will all know a bit more if the chamber is cast and the bore measured as suggested in my previous contribution.


Patrick

[Story]

Sooooooooo... whatever was the resolution?

[Buccaneer]

Sooooooooo... whatever was the resolution?

Still ongoing with my research whatever it turns out to be it will have to go to the proof house as it has no proof marks that I can find, I will post results when I eventually get them. Thanks for your interest.

[Patrick Chadwick]

Still ongoing with my research whatever it turns out to be it will have to go to the proof house as it has no proof marks that I can find,

Oh yes it has! Take a very close look at the root of the bolt handle, where the number is stamped. That looks like a crown over BNP - in other words, it has been proofed in the UK in recent times!

[Buccaneer]

Oh yes it has! Take a very close look at the root of the bolt handle, where the number is stamped. That looks like a crown over BNP - in other words, it has been proofed in the UK in recent times

Well spotted you are quite right but the rifle itself does not have any legal proof marks and as I understand it it will have to go through proof as a complete assembly and then marked as such.

[Buccaneer]

Sooooooooo... whatever was the resolution?

Yes there is... at long last the mystery has been solved, well in part at least. I think that the general conclusion that the metal work has been refinished is correct, done to a very high standard and probably a long time ago. The real odd ball was the bolt / calibre and this was resolved when we realised that the wrong bolt head was fitted, this rifle was bought at auction and was probably assembled with the wrong part to make it look presentable. Many thanks to Phil Rose for all the work in solving the problem and getting the correct bolt head from the States and doing the necessary work to get it through the proof house.
What was the end result 7.92 x 57mm now head spaced, proofed and ready to go. Many thanks to all for there input, sorry its taken so long to get to the end.