Early/ Late SA 1903 Salvageable? Input Needed.

[HOOKED ON HISTORY]

Thanks fellas for the clarification on the serial number range. I wasn't sure whether it was 800000 or 900000.

Looks as though it is not quite cut and dry. In all likleyhood mine will not be used a great deal but I will "proceede with caution".

[Calif-Steve]

It is a fact that 800,000 is the "magic number" for SA manufacture. The story goes that Springfield found a small pile of unfinished receivers and put them into the production line after the double heat treatment process had started. Mind you Springfield did not destroy any old receivers and did not re-heat the old recievers, either. I have read the small lot was something like 20-30 recievers, but have no idea where that number comes from and frankly I doubt that fact. But Rick is correct that around 750,000 double heat treating had begun and by 780,000 all new production was double heat treated. But, Springfield still had old receivers/raw forgings in the system and they all went into rifle production. At 800,000 Springfield had all of the old receivers out the door. Or, so they thought.

[HOOKED ON HISTORY]

UPDATE.
Decision time. For $260 I can obtain all the missing bits here http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/1903spfkit.aspx with the stock handguard etc... along with many parts I do not need (cheaper than purchasing just the ones I do seperately) that I suppose I could sell off to defer the cost of restoration.
I do have a question about the rear sight. The windage knob is not included in the kit. Is it required for mounting of the rear sight? I have not found any instructions for mounting of the rear sight.

[Dad]

I bought the same Sarco '03 kit to "rebuild" a M1903 display rifle for a guy that just wanted a "non-firing wall hanger".
In the kit, some of the parts are USGI, but there are also some chinese reproduction parts....
The lower barrel band and the stamped '03-A3 trigger guard supplied, are chinese reproductions.
Also the bolt, firing pin rod, bolt shroud/safety, buttplate, follower spring, trigger, lower band spring and mag cutoff in the kit I received were '03-A3 parts.
So if you plan to restore your rifle as a M1903 this kit is not for you. It just has too many of the wrong parts.

D.

[HOOKED ON HISTORY]

It just has too many of the wrong parts.

Good save! The search continues.
Thanks.

[Calif-Steve]

Scrapco has piles of junk. Try Bill Ricca and the Dealers Warehouse for odds and ends. Avoid any "deals" as you will get burned.

[Rick the Librarian]

Couldn't agree more - the same is true of Numrich (GPC). You'll be a lot happier if you take the time to run down the parts individual and know you're getting the "real deal".

[Fred G.]

It is interesting to me how much "transition" there was in the changeover from case-hardened to double heat-treatment. Supposedly, the process was introduced in the 750,000 range and the transition was completed in the 780,000 range. However, as I said above, a few of the older receivers "leaked" through. In the case of Rock Island, although the SURE cheangeover was by s/n 285,507, there was, apparently, several though lower numbered receivers in the 268,000-282,000 range that were also double heat-treated.

Kind of confusing!!

More than just several Rock Island lower numbered receivers were double heat treated. I was surprised to learn from the information in Nick Ferris' book on pages 67 and 68, that out of the 16,000 Rock Island receivers below serial number 285507, "some 5,846 receivers having the old heat treatment were destroyed." This would have left about 10,154 receivers. "These receivers had apparently Not been heat treated and were, therefore, held back to receive a newly developed double heat treatment. Since the receivers had been machined from steel billets having questionable chemical composition, the receivers were tested during March and April for chemical composition and scleroscopic hardness following double heat treatment. It was determined to test each piece after hardening by scleroscope and to reject all pieces measuring below 55 and above 70 hard. This insured that pieces too high and too low were not used. Rock Island reported that most receivers passed the test and were eventually assembled to finished rifles."
I don't know how many receivers the word "most" covers, but I figure that the number of double heat treated low number receivers that passed must've been around 10,000. John Beard, who is one of the most knowledgeable persons concerning 1903's on the planet, recently stated that "Rock Island Arsenal wartime records indicate that about 10,000 low number receivers were actually double-heat treated."
Rick owns one of these rifles himself. Apparently so do I. I wonder how many of these low numbered double heat treated Rock Island rifles are out there still? Without John Beards identification of our rifles, neither Rick or I would know what we had. Well, we can feel safe if we ever decide to shoot them!

[Calif-Steve]

Rock Island went to great lengths to ensure only safe rifles were produced, even destroying finished receivers. Sprindfield did not do this at all. They simply continued to march and produced rifles with no regard to low number/high number. Rock Island has a rock-solid serial number of their first high number receiver. Springfield felt 800,000 was the proper serial number for high number receivers. We know today Springfield was a least a little "off".

[HOOKED ON HISTORY]

We know today Springfield was a least a little "off".

Hopfully (In my case) "a little off" is not by more than 555.