New Addition: 1957 Mk3 Bren Gun

[Flying10uk]

tankhunter, unless I'm misunderstanding something there is only the option of attaching the sling on the Mk3 butt to the original side sling loop or doing the mod and fitting the top loop, as Peter suggests or is there a 3rd option???

[tankhunter]

No. My 'suggestion.' was aimed at preventing the rear hook from Damaging the wood finish on Butt. On a STANDARD UNMODIFIED Bren Buttplate. (MK,III + L4 Butts Only)
As it is a Deact the original 'Poster' has in his possession. (One of a few in his collection) This omission of the sling Hook at the rear, would eliminate the problem He explained. (He wouldn't be carrying it far, or for very long!)

If the Mod of the Top Loop welded to the Later MK.IV Plate was utilised. (On the L4A5) there is absolutely NO Option but to use BOTH original sling hooks.
IF, you are going to fit the sling to the TOP Loop of the Modded Buttplate.

As Peter has stated, the gun does 'roll' away in the carrying position with the sling fitted to the side of the long sling loop. The Mod of the welded loop at the top of the plate. Eliminated this awkward phenominum & stopped the wood furniture getting damaged by the rear sling Hook Assembly.

[graham the bren]

Bought the 1949 mk3 from the same company very nice condition had plenty of use with one in 1982. will post numbers later.

[TactAdv]

If the Mod of the Top Loop welded to the Later MK.IV Plate was utilised. (On the L4A5) there is absolutely NO Option but to use BOTH original sling hooks.
IF, you are going to fit the sling to the TOP Loop of the Modded Buttplate.

As Peter has stated, the gun does 'roll' away in the carrying position with the sling fitted to the side of the long sling loop. The Mod of the welded loop at the top of the plate. Eliminated this awkward phenominum & stopped the wood furniture getting damaged by the rear sling Hook Assembly.

Like this.....??

-TomH

Attachment 65143Attachment 65144Attachment 65145

[Peter Laidler]

That's the idea! Did you get it like that or modify it?

[TactAdv]

Not mine! I just stole the pictures.....because they were relevant to the thread at hand. Shows exactly what you were talking about.....

Looks like a nice job, though. My guess is original??

So, speaking of things "inherently British" like top sling mounts.....riddle me this: With "our" BAR, it was almost universal that once they entered combat, first thing that happened was that the BAR-man removed his bipod.....almost to a man they took them off and used the BAR as just a large automatic rifle......just like 'ole John Moses intended. So then........

Why didn't Commonwealth Bren gunners ditch the bipod equally......the good reason to do so would have translated equally well when wielding a Bren gun???? And....unlike the BAR (as in M1918A2 variant) which didn't really have all that many good "hand holds", the Bren, any Mark, could actually be HELD AND CONTROLLED quite well with the pistol grip, barrel handle, and sling......not to mention if the forward handle had ever been issued in large numbers.

Quite a pithy to consider......that.

-TomH

PS-Well, yeah, lack of an underslung wooden handguard....like the BAR has,,,,,,,,,,but besides THAT.....which could have been gotten around on a "field expedient basis".

[Peter Laidler]

Good question Tom. Initially you couldn't shoot a Bren without a bipod because there were 6 gas vents in the gas cylinder under the swinging bipod sleeve. Take the bipod off and the operating gas will just vent to atmosphere. Later Mk2 guns came on stream with closed off gas vents. You could shoot these without the bipod. But the question then was where does your left hand hold the gun? Don't be fooled by the old chestnut that you could use it from the hip with the left hand holding the extended carrying handle. That's what we call 'utter twaddle'. There's only two parts to hold on to at the front of a Bren gun. The red-hot barrel and the red-hot gas cylinder!

The Bren was a true light machine gun and not an auto rifle so was the rifle section means of firepower during advance to contact and defensive ops. The forward grip (mentioned elsewhere in the Bren threads) was a good idea but only in the operational theatre where it was approved. And that was where by definition, there was really no scope to use a bipod in any case........ I mean......, where do you put it down in jungle where you can only see 5 yards?

[TactAdv]

Mk I gas cylinder.......Yep......Touche! Forgot about that issue.

OTOH, and with later gas cylinders, am still wondering why nobody ever came up with a simple wooden hand-guard that would slip around the whole rear portion of the gas tube?? No shortage of other guns with that for inspiration.

Maybe a "project" to test the idea>>>>> ;-)

-TomH

[Joe H]

Good question Tom. Initially you couldn't shoot a Bren without a bipod because there were 6 gas vents in the gas cylinder under the swinging bipod sleeve. Take the bipod off and the operating gas will just vent to atmosphere. Later Mk2 guns came on stream with closed off gas vents. You could shoot these without the bipod.

Peter,

Did they ever re-bore the gas cylinder hole in the MkI for the MKII gas cylinder? I have heard of a de-milled MkI parts kit that had the smooth gas cylinder hole.

Joe

[Peter Laidler]

We certainly didn't and thinking on my feet I seem to think this 'is it interchangeable' matter cropped up some time ago. I think that you COULD, at a push, machine the Mk2 type cylinder vent shoulder back until the taper pin holes in body and cylinder align and it'd sort of work. But not on a service gun.