Springfield Trapdoor Bannerman Special - Might be a Shooter

[dttuner]

"The rear sight appears to be a M1879 Carbine sight ( marked with a "C" on the side )."
Agreed. See Frasca/Hill p.84.


"The block is actually marke"d 1873"
You may well be right, but...


1) The last figure could be a 3" or an 8. Perhaps dttuner can clarify this? I thought it was an 8.

2) I am aware that there was no such thing as an "official" Model 1878. But, as the authors point out, there were numerous in-between versions.
On the page I cited the 4th breech block from the left appears to be marked US Model 1878. Maybe it's just my poor eyesight?
This version/edition/variation, call it what you like if you don't like the word Model - although that is what is stamped on it - has the rounded shoulder of the 1884 version. The versions clearly marked 1873 all have square shoulders.

3) In any case, the rifle appears to be a mixture. The stock appears to be made for a rifle with screw-clamp bands, hence the lack of band springs.

4) As the unfortunate object is way off being a "correct" collector's item, surely dttuner's first priority is to get it going as a shooter?

It looks like an "1873" to me. Although the "18" is basically worn off.

The band spring slots have been filled-in and refinished, however they are also in the wrong place for these barrel bands.
Either the stock is all wrong, or the barrel bands are wrong. Can't say.

---------- Post added at 01:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:08 PM ----------

..... the later M73 blocks were interchangeable with the M84 blocks, and were installed until they ran out of them. The receiver is actually a M84 receiver.

Thanks for this information!

The rear sight appears to be a M1879 Carbine sight ( marked with a "C" on the side ).

Cool, thanks!


Additional marking -
- Under the stock, there is a line on receiver and barrel which line-up (surely for barrel>receiver mounting reference), with a small "D" next to it.

---------- Post added at 01:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:11 PM ----------

Just noticed on the Lock plate, there's an "O" to the right of the "C".
See it?

[Dick Hosmer]

Sorry for the "bump", but there are a lot of problems with the answers given so far.

Late 1873 blocks DO have the rounded shoulders.

There is no quibbling/iffiness/maybe/"transition", etc. re "1878" blocks. NO such marking exists - it is ALWAYS a too-deep "3".

The stock is not even for a .45-70! The spoon (rod spring) was discontinued following the last of the .50-70 arms - the Model 1870 - BUT - NO "trapdoor" was ever made without band-springs. So, the stock is even earlier, most likely from a "type 1" M1863 muzzle-loading musket.

The lockplate is from a musket or a .50-70 - not a .45-70. It probably came with the stock.

The buttplate is from a Model 1877 carbine.



Collector value is just about zero - but the fun quotient is unlimited. I hope it shoots well!

Best wishes.

[breakeyp]

NJ New Jersey ownership.

[browningautorifle]

Sorry for the "bump", but there are a lot of problems with the answers given so far.

Late 1873 blocks DO have the rounded shoulders.

There is no quibbling/iffiness/maybe/"transition", etc. re "1878" blocks. NO such marking exists - it is ALWAYS a too-deep "3".

The stock is not even for a .45-70! The spoon (rod spring) was discontinued following the last of the .50-70 arms - the Model 1870 - BUT - NO "trapdoor" was ever made without band-springs. So, the stock is even earlier, most likely from a "type 1" M1863 muzzle-loading musket.

The lockplate is from a musket or a .50-70 - not a .45-70. It probably came with the stock.

The buttplate is from a Model 1877 carbine.



Collector value is just about zero - but the fun quotient is unlimited. I hope it shoots well!

Best wishes.

I love it when an authority comes up to clarify. Nothing like going to the source to sort this out...Thank Dick!

[Doco overboard]

Looks crisp and undamaged.

Pardon me for interfering, but at the picture of the chamber at 9:00 from where what I believe the extractor to be is that a crack at the chamber mouth? This is just an observation, I was just studying the photos to learn how to take better pictures myself, and it looks like that radius has a pie shaped chip. I hope I am wrong.

[dttuner]

Pardon me for interfering, but at the picture of the chamber at 9:00 from where what I believe the extractor to be is that a crack at the chamber mouth? This is just an observation, I was just studying the photos to learn how to take better pictures myself, and it looks like that radius has a pie shaped chip. I hope I am wrong.

Good eye. Seems that was just a fiber:

[dttuner]

Sorry to bring this back from the dead.

Just wanted to let the helpful folks who replied to this thread know that I'm
selling this rifle on the classifieds section.

Thanks!

[highpower3006]

You have the second NJ marked trapdoor that I have seen, mine being the other. Mine is a 1890 production also and the block is marked 1884.







The band has been turned right side up since this picture was taken.

[butlersrangers]

'highpower3006' - Your nice looking New Jersey marked 'trapdoor' seems to have the wrong rear barrel-band on it.

The "U" on the band is on the correct side for a Springfield arm, but , the open-end should point toward the muzzle. Also, there should be a groove across the top of the band so that the 'Buffington' rear-sight leaf can lie perfectly flat.

FWIW - I suspect that may be a Remington barrel-band (rolling-block or Remington-Lee) on your Springfield. Remington barrel-bands had the "U" on the left-side.