UNBELIEVABLE

[Aragorn243]

You fellows really present a dire image of the once proud RN. Only enough ships for one task group now?

[Merle]

You fellows really present a dire image of the once proud RN. Only enough ships for one task group now?

The US Navy isn't the only one to shrink in recent years....

[Flying10uk]

John, you are forgetting that we now have the Type 45 Destroyer that is capable of tracking multiple targets and if necessary destroying them simultaneously. Admittedly we only have 6 of them and admittedly they can only be in one place at a given time but it is said that a Type 45 Destroyer is equal to 4 or 5 Type 42 Destroyers that they replaced. We often now work in partnership with other nations who may provide additional escort vessels if needed.

If there is indeed going to be just one active aircraft carrier, perhaps, someone should tell the navy because they are expecting to receive two active carriers, once HMS Prince of Wales has been completed.

[mrclark303]

Believe me guys, it gives me no pleasure to say so. The defence cuts of the last 20 years have been particularly savage, as we have spent most of that time in the sand pit, the RN was target no1 to rob blind of funds and has been cut to the bone ...

An incredibly stupid and shortsighted series of decision's for an Island trading Nation dependent on the seas for its Worldwide interest's.

The vast majority of the public live in total ignorance of the RN's very weak state .... still as long as we can borrow £25+ billion a year to give it away in foreign aid, the liberals are happy!

[Aragorn243]

The US Navy isn't the only one to shrink in recent years....

The US Navy has shrunk in number of ships but not necessarily in strength. 11 Carrier strike groups are being maintained. And that doesn't include the Amphibious warfare groups which I believe there are nine at present.

[Flying10uk]

still as long as we can borrow £25+ billion a year to give it away in foreign aid, the liberals are happy!

I'm not sure that the £25+ billion figure is exactly the right amount, but putting this to one side for a moment; when I raised this matter with a politician who will remain nameless, a few years ago, I was told that foreign aid was now regarded as being on a par with defence for importance.

Whatever the true figure is that we spend on foreign aid it is a ridiculous amount of money.

---------- Post added at 12:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:42 AM ----------

here is still a Navyfied Typhoon on the drawing board which although isn't being persued at this time, has not been completely shelved either.

Wasn't there also plans to produce a marine version of the Jaguar aircraft in the 1960s that never materialised, perhaps because the U.K. cancelled plans to build new large fleet carriers that would be capable of operating them. It would be interesting to know how the Jaguar would have performed as a carrier based aircraft. If the land based version is anything to go by it would have been successful.

[mrclark303]

Here's the thing F10, the 6 T45's are a potent fleet of fine air defence destroyers. At knocking on for 8000 tons and with a very impressive area air defence ability.

Problem being only 3 are currently operating, 1 in refit, one in alongside maintenance and one temporarily withdrawn for crew training duties.

It's crew spread across the fleet to plug gaps.

At best, only 4 will ever be available for tasking and the Carriers will require 2 each when operationally deployed.

We will need to rely on our prime ally, the US (as we always do) to plug the gaps and cover our assets in the event of a shooting war, despite all the talk of the much vaulted Anglo French relationship, our continental cousins are no better off and will struggle to protect their own Naval assets.

With regard to the Jaguar, it was a fine aircraft, still much missed by many who flew and worked on it in the RAF

The main issue with the French carrier derivative, was the lack of thrust with its Adour Engines, the safety margins for single engine recovery to the ship was simply insufficient.

The other pressing issue was it wasn't 100% French of course!

[Flying10uk]

Hopefully we now see a gradual improvement in the capabilities of the Royal Navy as new ships start to appear with greater capabilities than the ships that they replace. For example there are 5 new off-shore patrol vessels which are on their way and the first of these will soon be completed. These are larger ships than their predecessors and, perhaps, may be able to take on some of the duties currently undertaken by Type 23 Frigates. There are 8 new Type 26 Frigates planned which should start to materialise soon, I would hope. I would expect these 8 frigates to have capabilities significantly improved from the current Type 23's. There are new submarines in-build, currently.

The Royal Fleet Auxiliary has 4 new replenishment at sea tankers built/in build, but sadly not in the U.K.. The first of these, at least, is already here in the U.K..

[mrclark303]

Yep, not all bad news I agree, let's just hope for better times ahead.

[Flying10uk]

With the keenness and apparent eagerness of politicians generally to donate foreign aid, the 2 new aircraft carriers will be able to play their role here too, if needed, in disaster relief. Just think of the number of helicopters that the carriers will be capable of taking to a disaster area and of the relief supplies that the ships will be able to transport. The carriers could provide a most useful asset in the disaster relief role, if required, and it was decided to use them in this way.