Pre-Ban vs. Post-Ban M14/M1A

[floydthecat]

Good information. The couple of M21’s I’ve seen look very mil-spec and do include Winchester barrels, Winchester TG and TRW bolts. The builds I’ve seen look exactly like the rifle I want. Fulton seems to have a very good reputation in the Carbine world and they really like their stuff. I’ll have to seriously consider your remarks concerning their receivers.

[fjruple]

In the U.S. "pre-ban, post-ban" went out the window with the demise of the federal "assault weapons ban" in 2004. Post ban military style weapons were restricted in cosmetic features such as bayonet lugs, flash hiders, and the like. In New Jersey there is no pre-ban.. when it is banned you can not have it. New Jersey has the most restrictive firearms controls in the U.S.A. M1As were to be banned in NJ but SA Inc took off the bayonet lug and changed the logo. A number of states have state laws that mimic the old federal assault weapons ban that are in effect today. Take care in travel.

Not quite right. You were given the option of registering the rifle as an assault weapon for $50.00 US in which you can also keep the hi-cap magazines as well. Additionally there is also a NJ attorney general's determination that M14 style rifles that if they meet the criteria of "being substantially identical" more than two "evils" are banned. Evils being bayonets lug, flash hider, threaded barrel, pistol grip. detachable magazine, etc. If you have one with two evils or less you are good to go. Other than being banned by name such as the Chicom M14S, you should be good to go. Of course that will be changing here in NJ shortly.

---------- Post added at 07:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:10 AM ----------

Good information. The couple of M21’s I’ve seen look very mil-spec and do include Winchester barrels, Winchester TG and TRW bolts. The builds I’ve seen look exactly like the rifle I want. Fulton seems to have a very good reputation in the Carbine world and they really like their stuff. I’ll have to seriously consider your remarks concerning their receivers.

I believe Fulton's receivers are just a follow on to the Armscorp receivers made by Jack Freise in Baltimore. The commercial M21 is just a receiver marking to avoid the assault weapons ban in those states were M14s are ban by name. The M21 receiver can be just on a standard semi-auto rifle or one that is tricked out with all of the bells and whistles. single or double lagged receivers, NM barrels, scopes, etc. The military M21 is just a M14 NM with a Leatherwood scope and ART mount.

There is no consistency in the QA of most of the semi-auto receivers being produced. They all have there up and and downs in different periods of production. The worst was probably Federal Ordnance.

[floydthecat]

I've learned a lot here about what NOT to consider. I can get one built locally on a BULA receiver in the price-range I am looking at. The "built-up" guns likely don't carry the warranty that a NIB SA does and I think I need to consider that.

[browningautorifle]

The "built-up" guns likely don't carry the warranty that a NIB SA does

Matter of fact a home built rifle has exactly NO warranty. They have NO idea what you did with their receiver or parts.

[floydthecat]

Maybe a first time buyer would want to place some emphasis on the lifetime SA warranty to the original purchaser. I have had good success with the SA warranty staff. Here is an example of a builder's support plan.....(paraphrased) "We do not test-fire or fit-n-finish. You are advised to have the weapon checked by a competent gunsmith prior to firing". Now isin't that a comforting thought. Dosen't take long for me to pass on that build. Just stuff some parts in a gun and sell it.

[browningautorifle]

Now isn't that a comforting thought. Doesn't take long for me to pass on that build.

We had a thread about that very thing not long ago, a dealer cranking together M1 rifles I think, substandard too... If you go into a huddle with Brian of BDL Ltd, he's here...you could go through a reputable dealer and perhaps get your rifle.

[fjruple]

Matter of fact a home built rifle has exactly NO warranty. They have NO idea what you did with their receiver or parts.

Jim-- I agree additionally if you should have to sell the rifle for any reason and if the rifle should blow up in the new owner's face, you cold be looking at a heavy law suit since the builder is probably not a gunsmith by trade.

---------- Post added at 07:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:49 AM ----------

I recently looked at M1 Grand that someone put together to be on the cheap. The individual used a CAI cast receiver (way out of spec). I used SA 1963 .30-06 Garand barrel with a .308 Winchester insert (comes out easily, US Navy tried this during the Vietnam War and junked the idea when in rapid fire the insert would come out, firing a 7.62mm NATO round in a .30-06 chamber is not a good idea), an Italian modified op rod which 1/2 inch too short for the gas cylinder. All of the other parts are well used and are heavily sand blasted and refinished but the stock was very nice from a Beretta M1. Definitely a disaster waiting to happen.

Cheers

--fjruple

[browningautorifle]

you cold be looking at a heavy law suit since the builder is probably not a gunsmith by trade.

Probably even if you were you'd face the troubles...

[Neal Myers]

I have been inside Fulton Armory (I don't think that they allow visitors now). Like SA Inc, they also offer a lifetime warranty. They call their products "hand crafted", & that's not an exaggeration. Each rifle is assembled, gauged, & tested one at a time. Not cheap, but premium quality never is.

[Sunray]

Clinton's ban did not apply to the M1A. Hence, there's no such thing as a pre or post ban SA Inc. rifle.
"...want to pick the right one..." To do what? How much money do you want to spend?
The M21 is a military designation for a gussied up M-14 based sniper rifle. Closest would probably be a scoped M1A 'Loaded' with the walnut stock. Must say the unscoped, semi'd, Winchester with the fibreglass stock I have is very pleasant to carry at 9.8 pounds. So a Standard with either synthetic stock will do nicely too.
"...Ruger has taken the art of investment casting to a new level..." Ruger's entire firearm business is based on that. Was right from the get go. They still have a "side-line" business making stuff for industry.
Cast parts are not the same thing as investment cast either. However, your vehicle's engine block is cast. Ever see one break?
"...US Navy tried this during the Vietnam War..." Tried it in the 1950's. Long before the U.S. got involved in SEA.
And any rifle Century had anything to do with is suspect at best. They are notorious for assembly rifles out of parts bins with zero QC. Not even checking the headspace to ensure the thing was safe to shoot.