M1 Garand Lower Band Pin Question(s)

[Bob Seijas]

The issue is not whether the pin is in place, it's whether it shows signs of having been removed or replaced. That is a strong sign of originality, you can't rebarrel a receiver without taking it off. The best telltale is undisturbed original staking.

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[Ms15710]

The issue is not whether the pin is in place, it's whether it shows signs of having been removed or replaced. That is a strong sign of originality, you can't rebarrel a receiver without taking it off. The best telltale is undisturbed original staking.
Attachment 123406

Interesting, thank you!

In this regard, if the pin is missing but there are no signs that it was removed, does this mean anything?

Is it possible that they could just fall out on their own?

[Jersey Devil]

Interesting, thank you!

In this regard, if the pin is missing but there are no signs that it was removed, does this mean anything?

Is it possible that they could just fall out on their own?

It's unlikely that a lower band pin would fall out on its own because they were staked in place. As you can see in Mr. Seijas' photo above, there's a bit of metal that's disturbed on either side of the pin. That was done so as to prevent the pin from coming loose and falling out. I've never seen a truly original, unmolested example that didn't have the pin in place. I suppose anything is possible, but I'd be highly suspect of such an example that claims originality but has a missing lower band pin.

[Ms15710]

It's unlikely that a lower band pin would fall out on its own because they were staked in place. As you can see in Mr. Seijas' photo above, there's a bit of metal that's disturbed on either side of the pin. That was done so as to prevent the pin from coming loose and falling out. I've never seen a truly original, unmolested example that didn't have the pin in place. I suppose anything is possible, but I'd be highly suspect of such an example that claims originality but has a missing lower band pin.

Thank you for the reply!

I would assume as much that there’s no feasible way it would fall out on its own with indented metal to keep it in.

Moreover, is it safe to assume that on these completely undisturbed rifles the staking is only on one side of the lower band? And evidence of disturbed metal on both sides is rather suspect?

I am just on the lookout for an all original rifle, and am taking all of these details into consideration so I know exactly what to look for.

[Jersey Devil]

Thank you for the reply!
I would assume as much that there’s no feasible way it would fall out on its own with indented metal to keep it in.
Moreover, is it safe to assume that on these completely undisturbed rifles the staking is only on one side of the lower band? And evidence of disturbed metal on both sides is rather suspect?
I am just on the lookout for an all original rifle, and am taking all of these details into consideration so I know exactly what to look for.

You're welcome, happy to help!
Correct. Once a pin is staked in place it's typically there for good unless a rather considerable amount of effort is used to remove it. Often this would mean using something pointed to get between the staking and defeat it thus driving the pin out one side or the other.
The staking was done on either side so as to prevent the pin from being driven out either direction. The only pin that comes to mind which could be driven out in one direction only is the one that retains the front sight base on the M-16-type rifles. That's a tapered pin, which was only staked on one side.
An all original rifle SHOULD come with proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the rifle's actually original. This is actually quite rare, and many just come with stories. That said, buy the example for the proof that you uncover through dedicated research and consultation, and the proof that it's presented with. As they say, "buy the rifle, not the story!"
Cheers,
--Brian