Argentino M1879 Rolling Block. Is it worth restoring?

[jmoore]

killforfood, I don't like most of my photos, but at least these cheap auto digital cameras neither make you wait for results nor eat you up w/ processing costs. Pretty sure I take worse photos now than back in the nineties! However, the photo "kit" no longer weighs twenty+ pounds- probably 1 pound?!

Sooner or later you'll get a good shot or two of the muzzle end. Just keep plugging away (and deleting the failures)!

Thanks to you, I may finally embark on a .43 Spanish reloading venture as well (for another Remington Lee rifle). Plenty more info here than has surfaced on previous inqueries in the ammo and reloading forum on this site.

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[killforfood]

killforfood, I don't like most of my photos, but at least these cheap auto digital cameras neither make you wait for results nor eat you up w/ processing costs. Pretty sure I take worse photos now than back in the nineties! However, the photo "kit" no longer weighs twenty+ pounds- probably 1 pound?!

Agreed… When I go on a hunting trip, I take hundreds of photos but delete most of them. Sometimes I get to thinking that I’m a pretty good photographer but have to remind myself that I deleted twenty bad shots just to get one good one. When the digitals first came out I thought they were junk and had no use for them. Now I would never go back. It’s actually pretty amazing what can be done with a little digital camera that fits in a shirt pocket.

Thanks to you, I may finally embark on a .43 Spanish reloading venture as well (for another Remington Lee rifle).

COOL!!!

Plenty more info here than has surfaced on previous inqueries in the ammo and reloading forum on this site.

Yah, this BPRC stuff is all new to me. I just learned that I will need to compress the load first then insert a wad and then seat the bullet.
I’m starting to order supplies and found myself staring at a long list of wad choices with no clue what thickness or material would be proper???
I guess I have a lot more reading to do.

Joel.

[Patrick Chadwick]

Yah, this BPRC stuff is all new to me. I just learned that I will need to compress the load first then insert a wad and then seat the bullet.

NO! Who told you that? "...need... " is nonsense. It's a possible option, maybe, not a need. And if you use it, it's yet another variable to be controlled. What happened to KISS?

Joel, I believe I warned you with words to the effect that you are going to hear a lot of claptrap about the blackpowder business. And what is the evidence that he (or she) knows what he's talking about? Maybe they really do know something, but can they prove it?
State champion? - OK, I bow to superior knowledge.
Shooting the breeze at the bar? - Smile politely and file it away for critical examination later.

Whether you can use compression or not depends on the powder. Again and again I hear from others that they have discovered that Swiss powder does not like being compressed - results become very variable - annoyingly sensitive to the exact amount of compression. Other powders seem to work just fine with compression. There is no hard and fast rule for all powders. Anyone who claims that has proved their ignorance.

AND FURTHERMORE - why should it be compressed? OK some S-A says he can squeeze in 5 more grains that way. So what! What does he need the extra 5 grains for. There can be a sort of macho competition "My load is bigger than yours, ha ha!". As someone who has had to give up rifle shooting (temporarily, I hope) because of a wrecked shoulder, I can do without "impress your friends" loads.

If 67 gns of Swiss powder can boot a 520 gn lead bullet over 1000 yards and hit the target (at Bisley) - if I can come second in Germany at 300 meters with that much powder - if I can come second in France with that much powder - then, believe me, although I may be second rate with first-rate moments, I do have a clue as to how to do it.

Perleeese, don't give me the feeling I'm wasting my time. We've come so far with this project
that I want to see that RB shooting well. When that has been proven, with the loading method I will recommend, then you are out and free, and will make your own learning experiences, mistakes - and successes. But until then, please stick with the "spoon feeding". Note what others tell you, but don't let them worry you! If you chase everything other people recommend you will be confused - as I was, for years.

Sorry if that was a bit of a rant, but I am sick of those who tell me about their "tack drivers" who "never come out of the 10" and who mysteriously never appear at any state or national level competition.

OK guys, I'm quite calm now, and looking forwards to FINALLY seeing some pics of the muzzle of that Argentine Rolling Block in .43 Spanish (go to keep the Google hit rate up!)


Sorry! Forgot to write Jamison .43 Spanish for Google's benefit

[Patrick Chadwick]

It's pack-rat time again!

I’m starting to order supplies and found myself staring at a long list of wad choices with no clue what thickness or material would be proper???

Remember KISS and forget the offers of exotic materials for the moment. Just get some empty and washed out milk cartons (if you have them where you reside). They are made from a kind of waxed card that is ideal for wads. Or the card used for six-packs of bottled beer (glazed on one side). And a wad cutter for .451, for muzzle-loading rifles. That is spot-on. Otherwise, 12mm will work. 1/2" is far too large. 7/16 is too small. And I don't suppose 29/64" exists!

And an empty 30M1 Carbine case (357 or 38 special will work, but the carbine case is easier to use).

And a couple of 5cc (5ml) one-way plastic syringes (without the needles of course) from the apothecary or (pack-ratting again) scrounged from your doctor or dentist.

Don't worry - it's like the 3.5" diskettes - there is a method in my madness. Just trust me!

The real snake oil territory is in the matter of BP lubricants. Just about every conceivable combination of animal and vegetable fats and waxes has its fans. If snakes do indeed produce oil, there will be someone out there claiming that snake oil is the only thing to use. Jelly (pinched from the kids party) and Nivea cream have also been used. The only common thread I can get out of endless recipes is:

a) the animal grease/vegetable oil brew must provide moisture when it is broken down by the burning powder in the bore. The burnt powder and lubricant form a kind of emulsion. The major function of BP lubricant is not lubrication as in bearings, but to keep the fouling soft. Some lubrication of course, but moisturization is extremely important, to stop the BP residues from being baked hard onto the surface of the bore. That is why, after the first shot in a BP rifle, you have crud-riding rather than bore-riding bullets (unless you clean the bore thoroughly after every shot - which is a drag). It is also why the first shot (a.k.a "fouling shot") can have a noticeably different point of impact to subsequent shots. So forget the alchemy department and just buy something that is intended for black powder muzzle loaders. You need something soft and pasty. Toothpaste consistency at room temperature is about right.

b) MINERAL oils are an absolute NO NO They do not provide the moisture for emulsification of the BP residues. They just make a dreadful mess with those residues.

That's it for tonight. I'm still waiting for muzzle pics!


---------- Post added at 01:01 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:59 AM ----------

I’ve been struggling with how to buy black powder for a decent price through mail-order. Well my worries are over.

Tha is why you need to make friends with other BP shooters - so you can share a minimum order!

He only sells Goex and has 1Fg or 2Fg but no 1.5Fg. What would you suggest?

2Fg. 1 Fg is for miniature cannons and the like.

[killforfood]

Just a joke test to see if the Google hit rate goes up.

Joel, keep on boning up that Argentine Rolling block and let's hope you soon get the Jamison .43 Spanish cartridge cases!

Now to post that, and tiptoe over to Google...

Here you go Patrick,
You,re 7th on the first page on google search "jamison .43 spanish"


1. Argentino M1879 Rolling Block. Is it worth restoring?
4 posts - 3 authors
Joel, keep on boning up that Argentine icon Rolling block and let's hope you soon get the Jamison .43 Spanish cartridge cases! ...
Argentino M1879 Rolling Block. Is it worth restoring?

[Patrick Chadwick]

Just a joke test to see if the Google hit rate goes up.

Joel, keep on boning up that Argentine Rolling block and let's hope you soon get the Jamison .43 Spanish cartridge cases!

Now to post that, and tiptoe over to Google...

[killforfood]

No worries Patrick, I haven’t “gone off the reservation”.
I can’t say that you didn’t warn me though.
I called Buffalo Arms with a couple simple order questions and a very helpful gentleman made my head spin with tons of information.
I’m just going to order the basics, JAMISON .43 SPANISH BRASS, (Google plug) Croft Barker Rolling Block book, loading dies, bullets and then we’ll go from there.

I’ve been struggling with how to buy black powder for a decent price through mail-order. Well my worries are over. I found a local store called Muzzle Loading And More. They are less than an hour from my house. I talked to a very nice gentleman named Bob he said that he has Goex in stock for $18.50lb. I would have to mail order a minimum of ten pounds to get that low of a price by mail order.
He only sells Goex and has 1Fg or 2Fg but no 1.5Fg. What would you suggest?
He also said he could give me a couple .45 balls to slug my bore with.
I ordered the brass rod to drive them through with and it should be here in a couple days.
I’m going to tap both ends for attachments, should the need arise.


Muzzleloading and More


The “Boning Up” is going better since I fired the dog but still slow. I have applied three coats total and need to let it dry some more before the next boning session.

I’ll try again to get decent muzzle shots up tonight unless the “Honeydo List” pre-empts. Man I hate putting up Christmas lights. Bah Humbug.

Joel.

[jmoore]

In the U.S. the followoing is pretty much the gold standard of "store bought" Lubes:

http://www.blackpowderspg.com/products_body.html#lube

SPG lube is good stuff, I like it, not that that that means squat in the real world!

[Claven2]

Store bought?!? Do people buy BP lube? I'd just get some no-name crisco and some pure beeswax from the craft store then make as much as you want for pennies.

[Patrick Chadwick]

Joel, try your Google link again!
This is what it shows me:

Argentino M1879 Rolling Block. Is it worth restoring?7 posts - 3 authors
Rolling Block in .43 Spanish (go to keep the Google hit rate up!) Sorry! Forgot to write Jamison .43 Spanish for Google's benefit ...

Up to No. 4 now!

If you would like some advice on how to fix the hinge on your "hair-loom" shotgun, please post a couple of pictures showing details of the hinge components. Above all, a close up of the existing pin. Then I can give you some "spoon-feeding" about adjusting (more likely: replacing) it.

Patrick