No5 MK1 questions

[villiers]

And were any fives FTR´ed with Mk 2 hung triggers??

Information

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[Peter Laidler]

Nope....... You've got the only one!

[pake]

Thanks to one and all who've contributed to answering my question regarding nose caps on No5's. And thanks too for the link to the Serial Number Survey at "that other site". It demonstrates at least that there are examples within the serial number range of my rifle which show both having and not having nose caps. That by itself is interesting.

So for now I am satisfied that my rifle probably is an original No5 MK1 in new or nearly new condition. I doubt that it was issued, but if if was I doubt that it was used much, if at all. Whether it was fired or not I don't know, but I haven't found evidence of that. I only bring up whether or not it has been fired as it may relate to some thoughts on "wandering zero".

Like most of you, I have read a little about the phenomenon. Several of you have decades of training and experience on these matters. These observations are mine alone and may not be worth the time it has taken me to relate them.

I am not an armorer but I do have lots of woodworking experience and am interested in how wood works and moves and continues to do so, particularly in furniture that is decades old and still used. Having said that...

This rifle, in it's current state, has a fully free floating barrel. With the upper hand guard removed a dollar bill can be easily moved between the barrel and the fore stock all the way to the nocks. This addresses Zellier's question and fits with Peter's answer regarding free floating barrels on new rifles. With the guard reassembled to the fore stock and the front band tight, the assembly is somewhat loose to the barrel, so no pinch points. I think the wooden parts have shrunk over the years even though they fit tight to each other when assembled. They seem dryer than the humidity level inside my home would indicate even though they have been stabilized here for more than a month.

Now then, even though the barrel floats now it has not always been that way and remember this rifle has not seen many, if any, firings. When the upper guard is removed and inspected there is evidence on the inside immediately below the band of prior contact between the guard and the barrel. The wood at that point shines and there are corresponding bright spots on the barrel. Whether this contact and rubbing off of finish occurred during initial fitting or afterward as a result of seasonal wood movement or simply the twisting of the wood assembly by normal hand pressure, I don't know. I doubt that it occurred as a result of barrel heating and expansion though since this piece has seen so little field use. And I'm not sure that it wasn't planned for although that seems odd. My reason for saying that is that the underside of the guard is not a consistent thickness front to back. From the front end to the band the guard is thicker by .040 - .050 In the barrel channel area I would guess. It almost looks intentional.

Anyway, I can see how for a variety of reasons the stock and barrel might make contact with each other. And since they could, I assume that they would , eventually, given conditions of enough moisture, mud and the normal flexing of the wood and the inevitable movement of a hot barrel harmonic. With that in mind, why wouldn't a Zero Wander? Pressure against a barrel sometimes and not others? You get the idea.

Anyway, thanks for the opportunity to contribute.

As always, YMMV, but I'm guessing that, yeah, these rifles, cute as they are to us now, probably were afflicted with wandering zero.

Respectfully,

pake

---------- Post added at 12:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:06 PM ----------

BTW, at my next range session, soon, I intend to let this old girl sing again.

pake

[villiers]

I´d just make sure that the screw at the front end of the trigger guard is nice and tight. If the handguard is rubbing the barrel, this can be easily remedied. `Tis best to remember that the barrel heats up quickly, so long periods of quick firing are best to be limited. I´ve got one motorbike and one rifle among several others that I´ll keep till I fall off my perch. The bike is a CCM motard and the rifle is a five.

[pake]

...I´ve got one motorbike and one rifle among several others that I´ll keep till I fall off my perch. The bike is a CCM motard and the rifle is a five.

I noticed that bike in your avatar earlier but didn't want to hijack my own thread. Since you brought it up though my two wheeled diversion/passion is an HD bagger. Only a biker knows and appreciates why a dog rides with his head out the window.

I'll check that front screw.

pake

btw villiers, I apologize for terribly butchering your name in my previous post calling you Zelliers.

[villiers]

No probs. Living in Germany, most people think I´m ..... FRENCH!

[pake]

In post 2 smle addict mentioned earlier threads discussing the importation of quantities of near mint No5s to the US in the 50s and 60s. That seems to fit the time frame of when the previous owner's father acquired my rifle.

Does anyone have any information on this possibility? A link to previous threads perhaps? Or any other help. I am very curious what the nature of this transfer might have been and how I can learn a little more about it.

Thanks Once Again!

pake

[smle addict]

I just spent the last hour searching threads (fun reading), and could not find the specifics of the importation. Many threads threads mention the importation of these rifles (and many others) in large numbers in the 50's/60's. But that is all that seems to be mentioned. I checked a couple of reference books, and magazine articles, and reference the pre GCA '68 imports flooding the market, but no specifics as to who brought 'em in. The three I have, as well as yours have the UK export marks. Receiver stamped "ENGLAND", and "BNP 13.5 tons per sq in". If I have missed something, I'm sure another member can elaborate more.

Have fun shooting it! They are tremendously enjoyable.

[Maxwell Smart]

Isn't the "ENGLAND" a US mark, rather than a UK one? The "BNP" is certainly a British mark.

[gsimmons]

Hopefully Beery will be along, but as I understand it the England is a US import mark. The BNP is the British commercial proof, required when the rifle was sold out of service.
Incidentally, the requirement for country of origin on goods imported into the US was because of all the cheap Swiss watches that were flooding the market in the 1850's-1870's.

---------- Post added at 06:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:18 AM ----------

Should have pre-1968 GCA