"New in the wrap" Bren mags and tin.

[Flying10uk]

I thought that some members may be interested to see a few pictures of this Bren mag tin and contents which I picked up a couple of years ago at a show; some of the mags haven't even been unwrapped. The unwrapped mags still look new and unused, however. I had got the tin out today because I knew there was at least one mag unwrapped and I have just purchased a wrapped mag this week to replace an unwrapped one. When I opened the tin I realised that I will need another 4 wrapped mags to get a "full house". I don't know if the tin is refurbished or was brand new when it was filled with the MK3 mags at Woolwich.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Peter Laidler]

Consider that each Bren was issued with 24 (+1 in the chest)* magazines plus 7 in bulk for each gun as replacements held in Ordnance as spares. The spares were replaced by orders placed monthly to the factories. The totals were colossal
* there were exceptions to this

[browningautorifle]

The totals were colossal

Plus the bits and pieces that were accumulated around your shop. Followers and distance plates, springs and bases...the odd body...

[Flying10uk]

It's very rare to find the mags still in the wrappers on the surplus market today though and I was lucky to see this tin at the end of the day, as well.

[Peter Laidler]

When the Brens were finally withdrawn, the longest serving bit of kit in the British Army incidentally, I went to a large salvage depot in Hampshire to see whether there was anything amongst the kit there that we wanted before it was sent for what was called 'certified destruction'. There were probably about a thousand - or thousands - of assorted Bren and L4 magazines, boxes, accessories, cleaning kits , second barrels etc etc etc. Most like new as towards the end they were rarely used............

The irony is that now, with the modern spec, you can't even insert an un-cut magazine.

[Flying10uk]

thousands - of assorted Bren and L4 magazines, boxes, accessories, cleaning kits , second barrels etc etc etc. Most like new as towards the end they were rarely used........

Do you know of any dealers selling MK3 Bren mags still in the wrapper, at affordable prices, then Peter? I've seen plenty of second hand mags for sale but I wasn't aware that ones still in the wrapper are in plentiful supply. I would be interested to hear of any dealers that have them for sale because I need another 4 to make up a tin full.


bigduke, I realise that you don't own a crystal ball but in your opinion, once we have left the E.U., do you think that there will ever be a time when pre 1995 deacs can legally be sold/traded/gifted within the U.K.. Thanks

[peregrinvs]

Do you know of any dealers selling MK3 Bren mags still in the wrapper, at affordable prices, then Peter? I've seen plenty of second hand mags for sale but I wasn't aware that ones still in the wrapper are in plentiful supply. I would be interested to hear of any dealers that have them for sale because I need another 4 to make up a tin full

You could try asking Saracen Exports. The Mk3 Bren I got from them a couple of years back came with a wrapped Mk3 magazine.

[bigduke6]

The irony is that now, with the modern spec, you can't even insert an un-cut magazine.

Part of the "legislation" states something on the lines of , A deactivated firearm not conforming to the new specification can only be sold/ transferred to a none EU country, so in affect when we pull out we will be free....... to trade our old specs (for a while).

I copied and pasted the following from the HMVF,



"So this has now been enacted, section 128 is the bit that deals with
deactivated firearms:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/...on/128/enacted

If you read through that it's not entirely clear what it means. Subsection
4(c) effectively makes it an offence to transfer a deac that isn't done to
the current spec., and by "current spec." I mean the June 13th, 2016 Home
Office spec. This is a different spec. to the April 2016 spec., which is
the EU spec. So taken as a whole, what it basically says is, it's illegal
to sell or gift a deactivated firearm inside the EU, unless it's done to the
current British spec.


Which makes no sense, because the British spec. is not the EU spec. They're
similar but there are differences.


The Home Office have attempted to give me clarification and their
clarification is very vague. What they appear to be saying is this: if the
UK leaves the EU, then the section becomes meaningless, because then all
transfers would be outside the EU and thus the section doesn't apply. If
the UK stays in the EU, they're going to try and get the European Commission
to adopt the current UK spec. and thus the two specifications will be the
same, and then they're going to apply for the earlier 2010 spec. to also be
recognised as sufficient so those can be transferred as well.


The reason they're being vague in my opinion is because (a) they came up
with their spec. prior to the referendum thus this whole thing has gotten
muddled as they didn't expect a "leave" vote and (b) they don't want to
admit they now have a contingency plan for either event.


What is noticeable to me is they appear to have no intention of applying for
any spec. prior to 2010 to be recognised as sufficient. But that only
matters if the UK stays in the EU.


Anyway the key point is that up until the UK leaving the EU, it's illegal to
sell or gift any deactivated firearm unless it's done to the current spec. -
once the section comes into force and the Home Office tells me that will be
in "the next couple of months" (but it's already illegal under European law
if the deac. is prior to April 2016). Note they've made it into an
indictable offence, so you can get 5 years in prison for violating it,
unlike with realistic imitation firearms where the maximum penalty is only
51 weeks".

[mrclark303]

Part of the "legislation" states something on the lines of , A deactivated firearm not conforming to the new specification can only be sold/ transferred to a none EU country, so in affect when we pull out we will be free....... to trade our old specs (for a while).

I copied and pasted the following from the HMVF,



"So this has now been enacted, section 128 is the bit that deals with
deactivated firearms:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/...on/128/enacted

If you read through that it's not entirely clear what it means. Subsection
4(c) effectively makes it an offence to transfer a deac that isn't done to
the current spec., and by "current spec." I mean the June 13th, 2016 Home
Office spec. This is a different spec. to the April 2016 spec., which is
the EU spec. So taken as a whole, what it basically says is, it's illegal
to sell or gift a deactivated firearm inside the EU, unless it's done to the
current British spec.


Which makes no sense, because the British spec. is not the EU spec. They're
similar but there are differences.


The Home Office have attempted to give me clarification and their
clarification is very vague. What they appear to be saying is this: if the
UK leaves the EU, then the section becomes meaningless, because then all
transfers would be outside the EU and thus the section doesn't apply. If
the UK stays in the EU, they're going to try and get the European Commission
to adopt the current UK spec. and thus the two specifications will be the
same, and then they're going to apply for the earlier 2010 spec. to also be
recognised as sufficient so those can be transferred as well.


The reason they're being vague in my opinion is because (a) they came up
with their spec. prior to the referendum thus this whole thing has gotten
muddled as they didn't expect a "leave" vote and (b) they don't want to
admit they now have a contingency plan for either event.


What is noticeable to me is they appear to have no intention of applying for
any spec. prior to 2010 to be recognised as sufficient. But that only
matters if the UK stays in the EU.


Anyway the key point is that up until the UK leaving the EU, it's illegal to
sell or gift any deactivated firearm unless it's done to the current spec. -
once the section comes into force and the Home Office tells me that will be
in "the next couple of months" (but it's already illegal under European law
if the deac. is prior to April 2016). Note they've made it into an
indictable offence, so you can get 5 years in prison for violating it,
unlike with realistic imitation firearms where the maximum penalty is only
51 weeks".

Thanks for that info Geoff, very interesting, many of us here have a blend of deactivated and live Firearms in our collections and this utter mess of pointless legislation needs booting back over the channel along with the rest of EU law. ROLL ON ARTICLE 50!

[bigduke6]

Its all explained in the above, once someone realises the mistake I doubt it would be long before its put right...... so yes there will be a gap from when we leave the EU (the sooner the better), where it doesn't apply to us, when you think of all the EU rules and regs we have come under its going to be a long time before they are all re written.

I wonder what driving licence we will get...... maybe revert to the old green one ???? but lets not get political.........as this is just rules and regs.