What Were They Thinking???

[Aragorn243]

OK a teaser title for sure, I kind of know what they were thinking but WOW, seems really, really stupid now looking back.

Now having the ability to compare physically quite a few contemporary rifles, the 1873 Springfield trapdoor seems almost stone age in comparison to most. Even the Martini-Henry could be explained to my non-gun wife as superior and she easily understood it.

Swiss Vetterli, not only bolt action but a repeater.
German M-71, developed two years earlier, still a single shot (not for long) but bolt action
French Gras, similar to M-71
Dutch Beaumont, see above two
Italian Vetterli, not as smooth but still a bolt action easily converted to repeater.

The Native Americans were better armed than the US military.

Don't get me wrong, it's a great rifle but it's years behind the time when it came out and was kept in service.

Information

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[Patrick Chadwick]

The outgoing point was the existence of hundreds of thousands of muzzle-loading rifles after the Civil War. What to do with them, now that cartridges were the ammunition of the future? The answer was the Allin conversion, which must have used up a good proportion of the muzzle-loaders worth converting. The next log(ist)ical step was the "small-bore" Allin - the Trapdoor.
This is still today a competition-winning rifle for accuracy, especially with the Buffington sichts. And much simpler than a tubular magazine rifle.

The conservative use of the Trapdoor while the early nitro-rifles were being developed, introduced - and becoming rapidly obsolete - meant that after the short Krag interlude the US was able to profit from the matured Mauser action and go quickly to the 1903. Sometimes it is better not to be an early-adopter.

[Sentryduty]

When I learned the evolution history of US Service firearms I too was surprised to see all of the great US and worldwide firearms development but the US Army was still fielding the Trapdoor until 1892.

It just seemed stoneaged for the period of rapid and interesting military firearms development. While it all worked out in the end, it seemed like no one in the US Army was seriously interested in developing an innovative "home-grown" weapon until the 1920's.

For some reason I expected to find a Lever Action in between the Trapdoor and the Krag, but that design seems to have been passed over by everyone except the Imperial Russian Army.

[WarPig1976]

I think also we weren't in an arms race with our neighbors. European powers have been in a ****ing contest forever. I may be wrong but I don't think the U.S at the time was worried about carrying on Warfare in Europe. We where concerned with fighting Indians and expanding Westward. I think it just comes down to the powers that be didn't think repeaters where necessary.

[Aragorn243]

Yes but the Indians had repeaters. They had better guns than the US military. They didn't blame Custer's disaster on the single shots, they blamed it on the copper cases not ejecting even though current investigations are not finding large instances of the cases being stuck. Even had they simply equipped the western units with better rifles, it would have been a start. They had the Spencer's in the Civil War where they proved their worth, what would the 1873 Winchester's done?

[vintage hunter]

but the Indians had repeaters.

Not all did. The Indians were known to have about 200 repeaters, most were armed with a variety of weapons ranging from war clubs, lances and bows to muzzle loaders and the few repeaters they'd managed to beg borrow or steal. It's been estimated that about 1 out of 10 warriors had Henry or Spencer repeaters.
I believe Custer himself had more to do with the 7th taking a beating than the type of weapons the two sides were armed with.

[WarPig1976]

They didn't blame Custer's disaster on the single shots

I agree with you. Arrogance and Money no doubt played a roll in the big picture. No way at the time would anyone admit the U.S Calvary got it's hat handed to it by a band of savages. Certainly no blame could be placed on the standard issue weapon either.

A bit macabre on my part, but I've always wondered if any of them offed himself rather then fall into Indian hands alive.

[Aragorn243]

History Channels had a few specials on the research being done at the battlefield. They have been mapping it based on where casings, etc have been found. Pretty interesting but it's been a while since I've seen it. I have heard discussion that some did save the last bullet but hard to tell, no one left to tell the tale. Although, there has been suggestion that one survived. Easy to tell who was where, the US had the 45-70, the Native Americans half a dozen different types. The research is not supporting the exact historical accounts. Similar but much more went on than suspected.