EFD No1 Mk I*** forend

[Smellymarkfive]

I'm looking for help/advice on putting the final touches to a new forend. I ordered one from EFD (the last one they're gonna have for a good while). The quality was very good and I have no complaints, but it is missing two features the originals have. First the outer band retaining pin is not drilled or fitted. Not a big deal just a little bit hairy drilling the hole, if I can't find the steel pin I can make one. The thing causing me the most head scratching is the brass cross pin at the butt end of the forearm. On the No1 Mk Is it looks like it is a piece of brass bar riveted with brass burrs at both ends. I'd like to get the thing as close to spec as possible, but I'm also wary of effing the whole thing up for the sake of a brass cross pin. Currently I'm weighing these options:
1. Do nothing
2. Use a pice of threaded brass like on later models (if I can find a longer piece than the bits I have)
3. Cut some pieces of brass and counter sink the wood and glue them in just to make it look right
4. Round off some brass nuts and get brass threaded bar and do it that way
5. Hope that someone out there has either correct parts, knows how it is done properly, or has better ideas
I've got some old smashed forends to practice on
Any help appreciated and I intend to shoot it too

Information

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[Smellysniper]

Hi. I had to repair my SMLE Mk 3 when the whole rear end split on me. Mine was the later type which is a piece of screwed bar simply screwed across the stock from side to side and cut off flush. From your description yours is the earlier type which is a brass pin with two brass washers rivetted on. If it is any help ,I think yours is the easier one to do and a better design. I do not know what sort of skill level you have or what sort of machinery,but if I describe how I would do it ,we can take it from there. The biggest problem is drilling the hole from side to side ,starting and ending in the right place. In my opinion it is better to start from each side and meet in the middle!. This is not easy by any means but if the worse happens and you cannot bodge up a meeting in the middle(by re-drilling the crooked hole at an angle from the start hole) ,you can cheat and put one in on each side and it will look good.The washers are .200" in diameter and you will need to make them about .050"thick to give yourself a bit of stability and also will allow you to put a countersink in the washer and peen the pin into itr after assembly .Try to use a brass pin with a bit of stiffness to it as it has to withstand a bit of end force when you are rivetting. It will also strengthen the forend.You will have to counterbore the wood to take the washer .it must end up flush. Drilling that is difficult .you really need a piloted counterbore. This all sound difficult but with care it will be OK. If you feel it is beyond you there are other ways to do it but for appearance only..I am much better at that sort of work than using forums so if you want to Email me tonymarotto@tiscali.co.uk for more advice,please do so. Regards, Tony

[Jagman]

I made a pin from 4-40 threaded rod, drilled and tapped the fore stock prior to insertion, tapped from each side of the fore stock as far as the tap would reach, the center section was not tapped - I tapered the pin to ease insertion.
very careful alignment prior to drilling was the key - you have to get the hole through the small wood bridge inside the stock.
If you want to add washers you could recess the wood and add the washer and peen the rod to hold them in place.

[Smellymarkfive]

Thanks guys for getting back to me. I'm going to try and get it as close to original as possible, but I just saw pictures of an LSA No1 MkI* with no cross pins at all. I've got the keeper plate and butt screw nicely matching up and they are very snug, maybe I should do nothing. As anyone else seen stocks with no reinforcement? Should I leave it alone? What is the life expectancy of a forend that's not reinforced?

[Son]

To be anything like what it originally was you need to know exactly what it was. Now, it is marked Mk1*** so that is the standard you need to finish it to. There are a couple of differences in that depending on when the rifle was originally made.. was it a Mk1 or a Mk1*. Build date would do that....
Then you need to read everything in the List of Changes pertaining to the model from when it was made to it's last marked modification.
For an example, part of LoC entry 13509 26 Sept 1905 and 2 July 1906 referring to the Sht LE Mk1 and the Sht LE ConDII says the "A screwed pin for foreends is fitted, replacing the Rivet, foreend with two washers." So, depending on when your rifle was first made, it might have had the pin with riveted washers or the brass threadwire. I noted reading the other day, the crosspin, retaining upper band was discontinued somewhere about the same time too.
While you are at it, check out LoC entry A1635 from May 1926 regarding changes to vocabulary. This is when the previos marks of rifles were brought into line under the one naming system. The Rifle No1 MkIII and Rifle No1 MkIII* were the new standard arms nomenclature. The LoC entry states that the entire Mk1 group (Mk1, Mk1*, Mk1***, ConD MkII, ConD MkII*, ConD MkIV among others) were omitted from vocabulary... that is their names were not changed. There is no such thing as a No1 Mk1.

Stick up some pics of the markings and I will see if I can work out what you need to do when I get a chance.

[Smellymarkfive]

[QUOTE=Son;331965]To be anything like what it originally was you need to know exactly what it was. Now, it is marked Mk1*** so that is the standard you need to finish it to. There are a couple of differences in that depending on when the rifle was originally made.. was it a Mk1 or a Mk1*. Build date would do that....
Then you need to read everything in the List of Changes pertaining to the model from when it was made to it's last marked modification.
For an example, part of LoC entry 13509 26 Sept 1905 and 2 July 1906 referring to the Sht LE Mk1 and the Sht LE ConDII says the "A screwed pin for foreends is fitted, replacing the Rivet, foreend with two washers." So, depending on when your rifle was first made, it might have had the pin with riveted washers or the brass threadwire. I noted reading the other day, the crosspin, retaining upper band was discontinued somewhere about the same time too.
While you are at it, check out LoC entry A1635 from May 1926 regarding changes to vocabulary. This is when the previos marks of rifles were brought into line under the one naming system. The Rifle No1 MkIII and Rifle No1 MkIII* were the new standard arms nomenclature. The LoC entry states that the entire Mk1 group (Mk1, Mk1*, Mk1***, ConD MkII, ConD MkII*, ConD MkIV among others) were omitted from vocabulary... that is their names were not changed. There is no such thing as a No1 Mk1.

Stick up some pics of the markings and I will see if I can work out what you need to do when I get a

---------- Post added at 05:54 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:49 AM ----------

[QUOTE=Smellymarkfive;332099]

To be anything like what it originally was you need to know exactly what it was. Now, it is marked Mk1*** so that is the standard you need to finish it to. There are a couple of differences in that depending on when the rifle was originally made.. was it a Mk1 or a Mk1*. Build date would do that....
Then you need to read everything in the List of Changes pertaining to the model from when it was made to it's last marked modification.
For an example, part of LoC entry 13509 26 Sept 1905 and 2 July 1906 referring to the Sht LE Mk1 and the Sht LE ConDII says the "A screwed pin for foreends is fitted, replacing the Rivet, foreend with two washers." So, depending on when your rifle was first made, it might have had the pin with riveted washers or the brass threadwire. I noted reading the other day, the crosspin, retaining upper band was discontinued somewhere about the same time too.
While you are at it, check out LoC entry A1635 from May 1926 regarding changes to vocabulary. This is when the previos marks of rifles were brought into line under the one naming system. The Rifle No1 MkIII and Rifle No1 MkIII* were the new standard arms nomenclature. The LoC entry states that the entire Mk1 group (Mk1, Mk1*, Mk1***, ConD MkII, ConD MkII*, ConD MkIV among others) were omitted from vocabulary... that is their names were not changed. There is no such thing as a No1 Mk1.

Stick up some pics of the markings and I will see if I can work out what you need to do when I get a

Thanks for the detailed reply. It is a 1905 BSA MkI upgraded to MkI*** there are no upgrade dates on the left of the receiver. The butt swivel is the early long lee single screw, but there was no other woodwork when I bought it. The place where the rear handguard sits on the barrel was only scratched by a single clip. I've tried putting up pics but I can't do it for some reason. I'll try again